November 12, 2019, 09:29:50 AM

Author Topic: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book  (Read 77943 times)

reddawn

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #45 on: July 05, 2013, 03:07:12 PM »
I find it odd that some posters don't think healing is good...healing is very strong.  Along with gaining life, it's probably the best way to counter aggro, especially if you're gaining mana over your opponent every turn.  The make-or-break moment in pretty much every game wherein I've played aggro against defensive/control is whether or not you can stop the other mage from healing and thus undoing all your work. 

If you either don't stop the defensive book from healing or you lose one of your majorly expensive creatures due to not healing it, it's game over.

In fact, I'm testing a defensive Warlock book at the moment, and have found Drain Soul to be really good for this exact reason.  It does everything a defensive/control book wants to do; help kill creatures and gain you life (life that cannot be Dispelled or Dissolved is pretty darn good.)
« Last Edit: July 05, 2013, 03:11:15 PM by reddawn »
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Shad0w

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #46 on: July 05, 2013, 04:32:50 PM »
Guys keep up the good work I am going to sticky this.
"Darth come prove to meet you are worthy of the fighting for your school in the arena and not just another scholar to be discarded like an worn out rag doll"


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cbalian

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #47 on: July 05, 2013, 05:42:48 PM »
I consider Drain Life & Drain Soul in a totally different category than a heal spell.  Anytime you can reduce the opponents life and increase yours at the same time is hugely valuable, and because it does damage it really can't be considered a "heal only" spell.

So yes definitely run Drain Life/Soul, but that isn't running a heal spell.

Although I do kind of like the enchantment that heals 4 dice of damage and you can reveal it whenever (meaning your creature can be on the other end of the arena and still get a heal since you don't need to be in range).  Since that one is so cheap both spell book wise and mana wise I've been considering that one.

I think my biggest thing for being "anti heal" if you want to call it that, is I've only ever cast a heal spell in one game ever.  90% of the games I've played I've never taken more than 2-3 points of damage the entire game so the heal spell sits in the book.

The question that raises is "Do you use a heal spell on a creature going to die OR summon another creature?"

My thought on that is I consider creatures expendable (sorry cuddly grizzly pooh bear) but for the same amount of spell book points you can summon a fully healed ready to go creature guaranteed.  Yes depending on the creature you are out a bit more mana BUT a heal is so random, you might heal a lot you might heal little or even nothing.

My dice rolling skills suck so I always try to rely on strategy over luck so any cards that are more "random" I generally shy away from.  It's the same reason I "generally" don't use big attack spells.  That big fireball is awesome when it hits and crits etc but I could also use an action and mana to do very little damage also.

reddawn

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #48 on: July 05, 2013, 06:19:01 PM »
I don't understand how you don't take more than 2-3 damage the entire game.  That sounds totally off, provided that you aren't playing against a vegetable.

And of course Drain Life/Soul is a heal spell...it's a heal spell and a damage spell.  That's just what the card does...?

I'm confused.  ???
« Last Edit: July 05, 2013, 06:25:02 PM by reddawn »
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baronzaltor

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #49 on: July 05, 2013, 06:49:50 PM »
I think hes talking more about the difference between heals are passive or secondary to effects vs a pure heal quick action.

Things like Vampirism, Death Link, Regeneration and Drain heal passively or in tandem with another effect.  In some cases not even taking an extra action (like Regeneration). 

Whereas a "heal spell" like Heal or Minor Heal require an action in the moment so it feels less like you are gaining traction as you heal.

Thats my presumption anyway.

reddawn

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #50 on: July 05, 2013, 07:07:06 PM »
Heal-over-time vs active healing could be an interesting discussion.  You're spending a single action either way, it's more of what you can afford to put in your book and whether or not you think your opponent is going to Dispel it.  If not, then regeneration effects become very efficient, but if so, then not so much. 
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baronzaltor

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #51 on: July 05, 2013, 07:09:14 PM »
Thats why I like Vampirism so much, you spend the action once and then it becomes a byproduct of your attacks. 

Heal Charm is interesting because you can invest the action ahead of time and reveal it later when you might be in more of a crunch.   Heal Charm is also cool because Fellalia can cast it for you, letting her off heal for you.

reddawn

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #52 on: July 05, 2013, 07:38:55 PM »
I actually like Vampirism more for the Beastmaster than the Warlock.  Animals don't have much in terms of special abilities, but Ape and Bear dice counts can get stupid high.  Vampiric Strike I use for Dark Pact Slayers usually, since it has synergy with their natural Piercing +2 (and blood reaper, kinda).  Sometimes an early Regrowth too, since they have an obnoxious amount of life for their cost.

I might actually play the Fairy now that she can do that.  Still, I can't shake the feeling that she's one Sniper Shotted attack spell away from death.
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cbalian

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #53 on: July 05, 2013, 09:15:23 PM »
I don't understand how you don't take more than 2-3 damage the entire game.  That sounds totally off, provided that you aren't playing against a vegetable.

And of course Drain Life/Soul is a heal spell...it's a heal spell and a damage spell.  That's just what the card does...?

I'm confused.  ???

I play pretty defensively for the most part so I shy away from taking damage.  It does make for slightly longer games, but so far I have never lost a game, and the worst danger I've ever been in is at 10 points of damage, but generally it is 2-3 (sometimes zero if I play as the Forcemaster, she has so many defensives and forcefields not much gets through to her).

So in my defensive line up I generally run something like...

Primary Line of Defense (CREATURE Guards)
I really love Guardian Angel and use her a LOT, I mainly like her because she can block melee AND ranged.  But other creatures are good guards too.  ALL of the cats have deflection, even the baby kittens so if I'm low on mana I toss a kitten out since they only cost 5.  They are cute furry shields.

2nd Line of Defense (DEFLECTIONS)
For those times your opponent has Elusive or you run out of creature guards I run a few Deflection methods.
- EVERY spell book regardless of which mage I play has Reflex Boots + Cobra Reflexes + Force Orb as a bare min
- I add Dancing Scimitar + Forcefield for Forcemaster,
- Depending I add Reverse Magic, Reverse Attack, Block, Nullify all useful BUT I add these sparingly as I like the more semi permanent boots, reflexes, force orb since they can be used over and over

3rd Line of Defense (ARMOR)
For the times my opponent gets through all my guards and has Elusive or removed all my Deflections or gets through them by attacking me more than 4 times in one round...in those very rare times they get through all that and I actually have to take a hit I have Armor
- Bearskin (or any of the 2 armor breastplates is a min - this varies by mage I play)
- Rhino Hide is super cheap (I like to mix enchants in addition to equipment, to avoid dissolve/dispel)
- Leather Gloves I toss in EVERY mage's  book as it is a freebie 1 armor for 2 mana and only 1 spell book point

So umm yes if they can get through all creature guards + all deflections, reverse attacks, reverse magic, block, nullify and they actually hit me I have 3-5 armor to absorb any non critical hits, so it is pretty rare I actually get hit at all but if I do it is maybe 1-2 damage.  Several games I've played I've taken 0 points of damage the entire game.  I run nullifys and reverse magics for those times they try to use direct damage spells on me OR they try to dissolve my equipment.  So I not only protect myself but protect the stuff that is protecting me.

Some of it could be luck of the dice, but I like to be prepared for almost anything and play it safe. 
Granted I am still pretty new to the game so I don't have a huge sample size to go on (only played about 20 games) and it could be my opponents style but so far haven't lost a match with the above cards in my book protecting my mage.

reddawn

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #54 on: July 05, 2013, 10:40:32 PM »
Sounds like your group needs to get acquainted with the Unavoidable trait...
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cbalian

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #55 on: July 05, 2013, 10:55:40 PM »
Unavoidable wouldn't work on tier 1 or 3 of the defense only tier 2.

I actually run Unavoidable + Elusive for my Force Master and it is very nice.

But yes unavoidable would throw a wrench into a good chunk of my defense, I might even use up a dispell on that one.

nitrodavid

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #56 on: July 06, 2013, 12:19:46 AM »
an unavoidable attack from an elusive creature or an unavoidable range attack will only be stopped by forcefield
Being Aussie we place all our cards face down, apart from enchantments which are face up

Fentum

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #57 on: July 06, 2013, 06:00:11 AM »

Cbalian wrote...


I play pretty defensively for the most part so I shy away from taking damage. 

That is a strong series of defensive tiers. I am interested in how it plays out. Do you generally turtle and set up all that stuff? I have never played anyone who tried that. Is the flow of the match a passive defensive build up by you followed by your counterpunch?

 


cbalian

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #58 on: July 06, 2013, 07:06:57 AM »

Cbalian wrote...


I play pretty defensively for the most part so I shy away from taking damage. 

That is a strong series of defensive tiers. I am interested in how it plays out. Do you generally turtle and set up all that stuff? I have never played anyone who tried that. Is the flow of the match a passive defensive build up by you followed by your counterpunch?

I don't really "turtle" or take time to set up...I like to keep the flow going and pressure on opponent mage.  So it is kind of a mix of send baby creatures for them to deal with really EARLY (kind of a mini rush/aggro) THEN while they are dealing with that I can set up...while summoning equipment/defensives etc.

To do this in a decent amount of time (or it would take forever to set up and I would get overrun) I use EVERY action possible.  The more things cast PER TURN the better to get set up faster than my opponent can handle it.  If they are too busy defending and staying alive they spend their resources on that and they can't really even mount an attack on me.  So honestly even all the defenses listed are the back up but I don't generally rely on them (but they are nice to have).

I am a HUGE fan of familiars and spawn points.  Like the last Beastmaster game I won I never summoned a single creature with my mage and still won.  I let the familiar cast the enchantments.  That gives me 4 actions per turn.  I'd love to run battle forge but it is spell book cost prohibitive in that deck, but I do run it in others. 

Mana regen is key to make use of those familiars and extra actions.  I get the mana flowers/mana crystals/ pendants / harmonize out early.  Getting 14+ mana per turn adds up to a lot of power over 10 mana per turn since it all adds up.  When I play the Wizard I deprive them of mana and toss upkeeps on them right away.  If your opponent is getting 6 mana a turn and you are getting 14 what are they really going to do to you with 6 mana?  At that point they can only get overwhelmed.

Since this is a pretty mana heavy set up I don't run attack spells (since they cost mana).  Well I run a couple, like Force Hammer to squash a temple or stuff like that, but I hate Temple of Light so that is dead usually within 1-2 turn of it hitting the board.  Other than that I mainly like to do damage with weapons, it's SO mana efficient.  So after the defenses are set up I pull out a bow and shoot them while they come at me, then a sword or something when they get closer.

It kind of all depends on the mage.

I guess for the Wizard I do "turtle" a little bit, but for the Forcemaster especially I like to get in on the action (battle fury with her sword doing 10+ dice of damage per round is deadly to the enemy).

For the Wizard my favorite combo is Gorgon Archer + Basilisk.  You can turtle all day long with those.  If they get close to you Basilisk to hold them in place the Gorgon pinging away with decent damage but esp with Weak, by the time they actually get to you they are doing 1 dice of damage and aren't a threat.  They also spend so much time killing the Archer because they see that as a threat, and with it regening that gives me so much time and mana on the Wizard to keep tossing other stuff at them...hence they never really attack my Mage if they are too busy dealing with creature threats.

So it isn't all defense, sometimes keeping pressure on them so they aren't attacking me is a "defense" too.

reddawn

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Re: A "Base" set of cards ALL Mages should have in there book
« Reply #59 on: July 06, 2013, 04:27:16 PM »
The amount of set up required for these defenses and such leaves me pretty skeptical, honestly.  What the heck is your opponent doing while you increase channeling, make spawnpoints, summon large/small/etc creatures, put on armor and defenses, and more?

In the games I play, I'm either full-on attacking or defending by turn 3 or 4 at the latest, with very little opportunity to set up anything beyond a mana crystal, a class-respective ring, and the couple of heavy creatures I need to attack or defend with.  After I learned good openings and taught them to my opponents, spawnpoints and other very expensive luxuries quickly fell out of favor.
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