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Author Topic: Feedback on Promo Cards  (Read 2990 times)

DeckBuilder

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Feedback on Promo Cards
« on: August 18, 2013, 09:20:32 AM »
Shad0w told us that promo cards serve as beta testing to obtain player feedback.
I explained feedback would be limited without a list of cards for everyone to discuss.
Someone kindly posted this link (with images) below.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/992092/current-promo-list

Power Creep
I personally believe that to keep players interested, a slow LCG like MW ideally needs to bring out new mechanics hence new competitive strategies. But there must also be a small amount of power creep to keep established mage builds happy. The trick is to keep this power creep as small as possible to prolong the obsolescence date of the oldest cards whilst giving us a tiny dose of power gaming. I've been pretty happy with AW because their expansions so far have brought in new innovative strategies. Some cards are currently never played competitively but the meta can always change to incorporate them (e.g. more Incorporeal creatures/conjurations appearing in competitive meta for Divine Might to be added to enchantment toolbox like Falcon Precision). In an ideal world, you would want every card to be costed just right but this never happens in practice hence the same (slightly under-costed) cards appear in competitive books. The fact I'm more concerned about wasting future release space with under-powered cards than overpowered cards is a tribute to the patient design team. So well done AW.

I also appreciate that promo cards are some of the "sexiest" cards being tested. It appears only Galador has been released so far and it is a sexy card, addressing flyers, metal armour guards and guards with no intercept. But it is not overpowered.

It is also hard to feedback on cards in isolation without knowing the context of the other cards in the set. Falcon Precision and Iron Golem being in the same set as FM is an obvious example. In the same way, the next set may introduce a solution to Iron Golems and kill zones (e.g. "reveal to teleport 1"). Even if a mistake is made, it can be corrected in the next expansion,

With the above caveats, after analysing the new card images, below is my initial feedback. I am sure players far better than me have far better points to make and I hope they will share them here. So, in order of images in the link...

Healing Wand - alternative to Purify. cheap and versatile but very action-intensive, why release Dispel Wand instead of this?

Sersiryx, Imp Familiar - action-burst abuse with Enchantment Transfusion after safely casting curses on self; suggest "level 1-2 curse enchantments on enemy objects"; checking what was cast was legal is also an issue; otherwise it's cool to see warlock curses get more love, making warlock more control.

Asyran Defender - cost gap in Holy creatures filled, Guardian Angel is so good though so used more as a cheap resilient guard remover, would making him a cleric be too good?

Stumble - love it (user-timed unlike Jinx) but we then need more mobility beyond Teleport and Force Push

Summoning Circle - bluffs a zone trap, ambush in slow creatures, range 2 unlike garrison = 6 teleport cost

Sandstorm - a range 2 fast zonal attack to primarily disrupt position/attacks, great against zonal control

Elfric's Life Ring - overcosted rubbish, please never waste space by printing this

Meditation Amulet - why this over Moonglow? Equipment has to be good competing in this slot. This is the card to make spawn points more competitive. The game values temporary denial of a fast action spell at 3 (Jinx). A 4-cost amulet that trades a full action for 4 mana may be considered in some spawn point builds (and solo FM). It's a full action burst not no-action persistent so needs a greater benefit.

Hurl Rock - fine cost-effect (avoidable unlike Arc / Flameblast) but a bit dull, still it fills an earth attack gap

Akiro's Favour - ridiculously good and under-costed, needs "friendly creature" target if designed as a boon only else too versatile, fine at that cost (without Magebind) as a "may reveal to re-roll and discard" (so as timed bad luck mitigation) to make the game more skillful

Ballista - open to abuse with multiple sequential attacks without reply action, needs Unique (unrealistic, multiples needed for zonal control) or rule change to only allow 1 ready marker use before or after each action (the better solution as this removes HoB errata which then brings ToL back as a competitive option).

Bloodcrag Minotaur - fine for some future Charge-based build (e.g. "soldiers gain Fast and Elusive")

Critical Strike - fine command enchantment that obsoletes Piercing Strike (most existing commands poor)

Gravikor - I finally view it and it's definitely great in some books but does not seem overpowered, just wary of making Iron Golems better in the current meta...

Hurl Meteorite - more Earth love with their Thunderbolt, very good with Wizard's Tower spell-switching utility

Lion Savagery - fine, with Minotaur it hints at a future Charge-based strategy (so Force Wave better etc)

Morning Star - fine but is it too much nerfing of Defence/Block/Reverse Attack with too much unavoidable?

Vorpal Blade - fine vanilla aggro, equal cost to versatile Mage Staff, will be popular but not overpowered

Temple High Guard - wow, very good but may be what Holy needs (so best guards with Guardian Angel), makes slam attacks even more tactical which is good

Altar of Peace - missing control piece (split among 4 schools), mana denial boost, Epic so not overpowered

Mordok's Tome - a cool card, suspect it flatters to deceive but nice flexibility, arcane mage only is in theme

Oscuda - more interesting than Dire Wolf, more armour hate (zonal critical), more Golem love (poison), reminds me that I suspect Screeching Harpy missed zonal and Psychic Immunity to make it competitive

Clear Mind - psychic Purify, niche meta-dependent, a lot of unnecessary FM hate in these promo cards

Spiked Buckler - seems very good but probably not overpowered with Morning Star in the same set

Altar of the Iron Guard - ok, this is poor design, it is far too cheap for a global effect and Legendary so the player going first gets a huge advantage. For that cost, you should delete "which you control, you may" to make it a benefit for both players. Global effect conjurations benefit both players ("just that I have more animals than you"). As a benefit for both players, one players who builds around it (Guardian Angel, Temple High Guard) will still gain more.

Debilitate - why this over Agony? Does not work with Charge. Maybe 1 copy for an enemy aggro mage? Please don't print this. Why not "this creature's attacks lose all keywords"? Now that would be a cool curse.

Holy Strike - why? It's not even a command. Divine Might may be played in an Incorporeal meta but this?

Plagued - a very interesting curse but more Iron Golem synergy, nice soft control to separate creatures


So my first impressions are, based on their current text, a few seem too strong (Altar of the Iron Guard, Akiro's Favour, Ballista, Sersyrix), a few seem too weak (Life Ring, Meditation Amulet, Debilitate, Holy Strike). But most of the promo cards seem fine, even taken out of context of their future card pool.

I think the important thing is for AW to ensure there is a vibrant competitive scene hence promoting the various strategies and mages so they are roughly equal in competitive viability. So if Holy zonal control needs a boost, maybe Temple High Guard is brought out early etc.

The most important thing is balance between mages and strategies. We know the current meta is now more balanced than the game's early aggro dominance (esp. Warlock). But there may be mages (Warlord? Priestess?) that need a bit of a boost to join the others. As well as weaker strategies (mana denial? Get that Altar of Peace released fast!). I've got no issues with standout cards that address imbalance (Beastmaster needed Galador). There will always be good cards and bad cards (varies by strategy and mage access). However, a more even power-level distribution among new cards would be best to widen the choice pool when players strategise.

Overall, having finally seen the promo cards, apart from a few, they are not something I'd worry playing against (half the battle is knowing they exist and anticipating their play). So I feel far less handicapped not having them. Keeping them shrouded in mystery only promotes resentment. My misgivings proved unfounded so well done to AW; they are mostly pitched at a nice level (with a few mis-steps).

Has anyone else spotted any potential abuse / broken uses for these cards with our current pool?
« Last Edit: August 18, 2013, 05:55:32 PM by DeckBuilder »
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Wiz-Pig

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Re: Feedback on Promo Cards
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2013, 09:47:10 PM »
Hi, someone here.

These are my thoughts on the Promos:

Summoning Circle:
I can't wait for this card to come out. I feel like it has enormous potential and versatility. One example as an extremely aggressive opening for the Johktari Beastmaster.

Round 1                                                           Round 2
X  X  E       Move forward two spaces,         X  S  E       (17+9=26 mana)
X  X  X       Quickcast Summoning Circle.   J   X  X       Reveal Summoning Circle,
X  X  X                               --------------->          X  X  X        Cast Dire Wolf, QC Rouse the Beast
J   X  X       (17 mana)                                      X  X  X        Attack with Dire Wolf (7 mana)

Healing Wand:
This seems appropriately costed and given the right tactical situation it might be worth using a spare action to use this wand, but you have to use an action to cast the damn thing in the first place, so I'm struggling to see how this is going to see any serious play.

Sersiryx:
Fantastic.  I find his spell casting ability to be generally superior to all other familiars so far when taken in the context of the Warlock strategies.

Stumble:
Great tech.

Sandstorm/Spiked Buckler
These cards just look like fun ^__^, which is always highly appreciated. I love the thematic element in both of them.

Elfric's Life Ring:
I guess I might put on in a Battle Forge deck *shrugs*

Meditation Amulet:
So in order to gain any benefit from this card you have to use a quick action followed by two full actions.... I want to like this idea, but for the life of me I can't imagine a build that would allow this to be a good card to play. Even with an opening involving familiars and or spawnpoints, I just don't see it. Maybe if it increased your channeling by one each time you used it...

Hurl Rock/Hurl Meteorite:
Nice rounding out of Earth Attack spells.

Ballista:
So Akiro's Hammer was too weak and you over compensated with Ballista... Something needs to be done to prevent the action stacking potential of this card or to at least make it more difficult to setup. Right now you can cast two of these in one turn then attack with both at the same time on the following turn potentially along with a QC attack spell and a creature activation (4 attacks with no chance for response! This is obviously heading the way of HoB)... there are a lot of ways to change the card to prevent that.

Akiro's Favor:
Right now this card is worded in such a way as to allow you to use it as a curse... this is crazy useful and versatile. I think it's a point or two undercosted, I don't think anyone would even blink at spending 2 mana on the reveal for this.
Magebind seems to address the potential strength of this card, on reflection I think a better solution may be to make the reveal cost equal to X where X=Creature's level/2 round up, or Creature's level -1.

Critical Strike/Lion Savagery:
Armor seems to be getting less and less useful...(especially with vorporal blade also)

Gravikor:
Seems appropriately costed for what it does.

BloodCrag Minotaur:
Looks like a great Shock troop. He's sure to strengthen Warlord decks significantly.

Vorporal Blade/Morning Star:
Two great options both sure to see plenty of play.

Temple High Guard:
I can see people putting Knockdown's in their decks just to get past this bastard. You simply don't melee this guy while he is guarding it isn't worth it.

Mordok's Tome:
Crazy powerful. This is a huge boost to the Wizard and a great theme enhancer.

Altar of Peace:
I see this being horribly abused in combination with the Ballista and Wizard's Tower. As if swarm strategies weren't already weak enough, yet another card that punishes you for having a lot of creatures. I think I would feel a lot better about this card if it was Holy mage only.

Oscuda:
Gross.

Clear Mind:
Great. Print it, a logical utility spell.

Debilitate:
I think this should at include Bloodthirsty, if not also Charge. Seems a little too limited.

Plagued:
Love the theme. Agree with Deckbuilder that it only further strengthen Iron Golem. Might be better to have the target be any living or undead corporeal creature. Plague golems don't really make a lot of sense anyway.


DeckBuilder

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Re: Feedback on Promo Cards
« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2013, 06:05:11 AM »
Meditation Amulet:
So in order to gain any benefit from this card you have to use a quick action followed by two full actions.... I want to like this idea, but for the life of me I can't imagine a build that would allow this to be a good card to play. Even with an opening involving familiars and or spawnpoints, I just don't see it. Maybe if it increased your channeling by one each time you used it...

Some great points - I would like to explore this first.

Getting creature spawnpoints competitive in the game will promote swarm as more viable. Which then justifies more anti-swarm tech like Altar of Peace (which like other tech should not be restricted, it's nice that 4 major schools each have 1 piece of the full suite). So how to get spawnpoints more competitive?

Meditation Amulet was obviously meant for use with spawnpoints. The question is "how much benefit"?

I think you are onto a really good idea with your last comment. What if Meditation Amulet was...

Full action: place 3 mana tokens on this card
Increase your channelling by total mana tokens on this card
Upkeep: remove 1 mana token on this card


This is a combination of burst and residual benefit. You are trading significant tempo loss for mana acceleration (this investment can also always be Dissolved). However, while you have a Spawnpoint as your source of full actions, I can see this becoming more playable.

You spend 1 fast + 4 (max. invest cost) then 1 full to get back 6 (3 + 2 +1) over 3 turns = average 2.
If you spend a 2nd consecutive full, you get back 18 (3 + 5 + 4 + 3 + 2 + 1) over 6 turns = average 3.
If you spend a 3rd consecutive full, you get back 36 (3 + 5 + 7 + 6 + 5 + 4 + 3 + 2 +1) over 9 turns = average 4.
I think that works out ok considering the investment.

This card concept, if created correctly, is a great opportunity to bring creature spawnpoints (hence swarm) into the competitive game.

« Last Edit: August 19, 2013, 06:28:41 PM by DeckBuilder »
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DeckBuilder

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Re: Feedback on Promo Cards
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2013, 06:19:11 PM »
Healing Wand:
This seems appropriately costed and given the right tactical situation it might be worth using a spare action to use this wand, but you have to use an action to cast the damn thing in the first place, so I'm struggling to see how this is going to see any serious play.

It is for swarm builds. We hope for more interesting condition-placing cards (more than 1 Weak, 1 Cripple, 2 Rot in Core; we now have Taint, Slam, Stuck etc). The fact it can remove Stun (Arc Lightning) makes it more versatile, both a Purify and Clear Mind. Many "One Big" strategy books fit 1 Purify against Gorgon control (and Warlock curse). If we assume cards like Meditation Amulet (once amended) will improve spawnpoints hence swarm viability, then this wand becomes a better choice of spell points to Purify for swarm builds. I do agree it's very action-intensive.

Ballista:
So Akiro's Hammer was too weak and you over compensated with Ballista... Something needs to be done to prevent the action stacking potential of this card or to at least make it more difficult to setup. Right now you can cast two of these in one turn then attack with both at the same time on the following turn potentially along with a QC attack spell and a creature activation (4 attacks with no chance for response! This is obviously heading the way of HoB)... there are a lot of ways to change the card to prevent that.

Ok, my solution is to permanently solve this problem by amending the rules, allowing only 1 ready marker action before or after a friendly action. This brings HoB back unchanged (multiples to boost a swarm build) which then brings ToL back as more playable. I appreciate this is radical. So how about a slower load rate of 3? It's so much better than Akiro's Hammer and far cheaper too. Then you could have "Engineer" that adds or subtracts 1 token (e.g. damage, mana or load) on a conjuration; this makes both conjurations more playable...

Akiro's Favor:
Right now this card is worded in such a way as to allow you to use it as a curse... this is crazy useful and versatile. I think it's a point or two undercosted, I don't think anyone would even blink at spending 2 mana on the reveal for this. Magebind seems to address the potential strength of this card, on reflection I think a better solution may be to make the reveal cost equal to X where X=Creature's level/2 round up, or Creature's level -1.

Sorry but this card is amazing as a persistent benefit. Option to re-roll (must take re-roll) is worth roughly 1/3 of the dice rolled. Then you have the ability to re-roll a crucial 50/50 effect making it 75/25. Or the ability to reroll a crucial 50/50 Daze check making it 75/25. You can only do 1 of them per round but their "exclusive or" aggregate effect is just too good at that price, maybe 2+5 magebind 2 for persistent effect, the same cost as Cobra Reflexes.

However I think it would be more interesting to leave it a 2/1 enchant (no magebind) but with "reveal to claim 1 effect then discard". I also quite like the unintended curse versatility. But this would change the spell name to "Fickle Fortune" to be both boon and bane. This leaves room for bluff as player 1 reveals to reroll (well) only for player 2 to reveal and reroll! I would make it even more versatile to suit its name: "reroll any 1 die or all attack dice" as a timed one-use effect. That gives War school some much-needed versatility to match Force Push.

Critical Strike/Lion Savagery:
Armor seems to be getting less and less useful...(especially with vorporal blade also)

I totally agree. You forgot Ballista. I assume they will hence have more multi-strike creatures to balance this? I suspect they will release an Incorporeal enchantment (so no Armour) with upkeep (perhaps cumulative) to make Divine Might more relevant...

Altar of Peace:
I see this being horribly abused in combination with the Ballista and Wizard's Tower. As if swarm strategies weren't already weak enough, yet another card that punishes you for having a lot of creatures. I think I would feel a lot better about this card if it was Holy mage only.

I appreciate your concern here but you are basing this on the current pool, not a future pool. If they manage to make creature spawnpoints competitive (e.g. with a better Meditation Amulet, the "Engineer" etc), then swarm will be competitive. In which case releasing this missing control piece will make sense. I agree about abuse with Ballista (even nerfed) but it is easily corrected by rewording. Though I suspect as a Temple, the wording is deliberate to exempt conjurations and counter strikes. I also like the symmetry of splitting 4 control conjurations among 4 major schools, all of them Epic but open to all. Finally, this opens up mana denial as a competitive strategy.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2013, 06:59:34 PM by DeckBuilder »
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Shad0w

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Re: Feedback on Promo Cards
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2013, 07:44:45 AM »
Shad0w told us that promo cards serve as beta testing to obtain player feedback.
I explained feedback would be limited without a list of cards for everyone to discuss.
Someone kindly posted this link (with images) below.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/992092/current-promo-list

Power Creep
I personally believe that to keep players interested, a slow LCG like MW ideally needs to bring out new mechanics hence new competitive strategies. But there must also be a small amount of power creep to keep established mage builds happy. The trick is to keep this power creep as small as possible to prolong the obsolescence date of the oldest cards whilst giving us a tiny dose of power gaming. I've been pretty happy with AW because their expansions so far have brought in new innovative strategies. Some cards are currently never played competitively but the meta can always change to incorporate them (e.g. more Incorporeal creatures/conjurations appearing in competitive meta for Divine Might to be added to enchantment toolbox like Falcon Precision). In an ideal world, you would want every card to be costed just right but this never happens in practice hence the same (slightly under-costed) cards appear in competitive books. The fact I'm more concerned about wasting future release space with under-powered cards than overpowered cards is a tribute to the patient design team. So well done AW.

I also appreciate that promo cards are some of the "sexiest" cards being tested. It appears only Galador has been released so far and it is a sexy card, addressing flyers, metal armour guards and guards with no intercept. But it is not overpowered.

It is also hard to feedback on cards in isolation without knowing the context of the other cards in the set. Falcon Precision and Iron Golem being in the same set as FM is an obvious example. In the same way, the next set may introduce a solution to Iron Golems and kill zones (e.g. "reveal to teleport 1"). Even if a mistake is made, it can be corrected in the next expansion,

With the above caveats, after analysing the new card images, below is my initial feedback. I am sure players far better than me have far better points to make and I hope they will share them here. So, in order of images in the link...

Healing Wand - alternative to Purify. cheap and versatile but very action-intensive, why release Dispel Wand instead of this?

Sersiryx, Imp Familiar - action-burst abuse with Enchantment Transfusion after safely casting curses on self; suggest "level 1-2 curse enchantments on enemy objects"; checking what was cast was legal is also an issue; otherwise it's cool to see warlock curses get more love, making warlock more control.

Asyran Defender - cost gap in Holy creatures filled, Guardian Angel is so good though so used more as a cheap resilient guard remover, would making him a cleric be too good?

Stumble - love it (user-timed unlike Jinx) but we then need more mobility beyond Teleport and Force Push

Summoning Circle - bluffs a zone trap, ambush in slow creatures, range 2 unlike garrison = 6 teleport cost

Sandstorm - a range 2 fast zonal attack to primarily disrupt position/attacks, great against zonal control

Elfric's Life Ring - overcosted rubbish, please never waste space by printing this

Meditation Amulet - why this over Moonglow? Equipment has to be good competing in this slot. This is the card to make spawn points more competitive. The game values temporary denial of a fast action spell at 3 (Jinx). A 4-cost amulet that trades a full action for 4 mana may be considered in some spawn point builds (and solo FM). It's a full action burst not no-action persistent so needs a greater benefit.

Hurl Rock - fine cost-effect (avoidable unlike Arc / Flameblast) but a bit dull, still it fills an earth attack gap

Akiro's Favour - ridiculously good and under-costed, needs "friendly creature" target if designed as a boon only else too versatile, fine at that cost (without Magebind) as a "may reveal to re-roll and discard" (so as timed bad luck mitigation) to make the game more skillful

Ballista - open to abuse with multiple sequential attacks without reply action, needs Unique (unrealistic, multiples needed for zonal control) or rule change to only allow 1 ready marker use before or after each action (the better solution as this removes HoB errata which then brings ToL back as a competitive option).

Bloodcrag Minotaur - fine for some future Charge-based build (e.g. "soldiers gain Fast and Elusive")

Critical Strike - fine command enchantment that obsoletes Piercing Strike (most existing commands poor)

Gravikor - I finally view it and it's definitely great in some books but does not seem overpowered, just wary of making Iron Golems better in the current meta...

Hurl Meteorite - more Earth love with their Thunderbolt, very good with Wizard's Tower spell-switching utility

Lion Savagery - fine, with Minotaur it hints at a future Charge-based strategy (so Force Wave better etc)

Morning Star - fine but is it too much nerfing of Defence/Block/Reverse Attack with too much unavoidable?

Vorpal Blade - fine vanilla aggro, equal cost to versatile Mage Staff, will be popular but not overpowered

Temple High Guard - wow, very good but may be what Holy needs (so best guards with Guardian Angel), makes slam attacks even more tactical which is good

Altar of Peace - missing control piece (split among 4 schools), mana denial boost, Epic so not overpowered

Mordok's Tome - a cool card, suspect it flatters to deceive but nice flexibility, arcane mage only is in theme

Oscuda - more interesting than Dire Wolf, more armour hate (zonal critical), more Golem love (poison), reminds me that I suspect Screeching Harpy missed zonal and Psychic Immunity to make it competitive

Clear Mind - psychic Purify, niche meta-dependent, a lot of unnecessary FM hate in these promo cards

Spiked Buckler - seems very good but probably not overpowered with Morning Star in the same set

Altar of the Iron Guard - ok, this is poor design, it is far too cheap for a global effect and Legendary so the player going first gets a huge advantage. For that cost, you should delete "which you control, you may" to make it a benefit for both players. Global effect conjurations benefit both players ("just that I have more animals than you"). As a benefit for both players, one players who builds around it (Guardian Angel, Temple High Guard) will still gain more.

Debilitate - why this over Agony? Does not work with Charge. Maybe 1 copy for an enemy aggro mage? Please don't print this. Why not "this creature's attacks lose all keywords"? Now that would be a cool curse.

Holy Strike - why? It's not even a command. Divine Might may be played in an Incorporeal meta but this?

Plagued - a very interesting curse but more Iron Golem synergy, nice soft control to separate creatures


So my first impressions are, based on their current text, a few seem too strong (Altar of the Iron Guard, Akiro's Favour, Ballista, Sersyrix), a few seem too weak (Life Ring, Meditation Amulet, Debilitate, Holy Strike). But most of the promo cards seem fine, even taken out of context of their future card pool.

I think the important thing is for AW to ensure there is a vibrant competitive scene hence promoting the various strategies and mages so they are roughly equal in competitive viability. So if Holy zonal control needs a boost, maybe Temple High Guard is brought out early etc.

The most important thing is balance between mages and strategies. We know the current meta is now more balanced than the game's early aggro dominance (esp. Warlock). But there may be mages (Warlord? Priestess?) that need a bit of a boost to join the others. As well as weaker strategies (mana denial? Get that Altar of Peace released fast!). I've got no issues with standout cards that address imbalance (Beastmaster needed Galador). There will always be good cards and bad cards (varies by strategy and mage access). However, a more even power-level distribution among new cards would be best to widen the choice pool when players strategise.

Overall, having finally seen the promo cards, apart from a few, they are not something I'd worry playing against (half the battle is knowing they exist and anticipating their play). So I feel far less handicapped not having them. Keeping them shrouded in mystery only promotes resentment. My misgivings proved unfounded so well done to AW; they are mostly pitched at a nice level (with a few mis-steps).

Has anyone else spotted any potential abuse / broken uses for these cards with our current pool?

Healing Wand - alternative to Purify. cheap and versatile but very action-intensive, why release Dispel Wand instead of this?

I wanted HW in CoK but I got out voted. I still have no issues with it.

Sersiryx, Imp Familiar - action-burst abuse with Enchantment Transfusion after safely casting curses on self; suggest "level 1-2 curse enchantments on enemy objects"; checking what was cast was legal is also an issue; otherwise it's cool to see warlock curses get more love, making warlock more control.

We wanted him to help power the curse Warlock builds

Asyran Defender - cost gap in Holy creatures filled, Guardian Angel is so good though so used more as a cheap resilient guard remover, would making him a cleric be too good?

I do like him in the holy knight style builds. Even on its own it is well rounded.

Stumble - love it (user-timed unlike Jinx) but we then need more mobility beyond Teleport and Force Push

I have used this to good effect and I like it

Summoning Circle - bluffs a zone trap, ambush in slow creatures, range 2 unlike garrison = 6 teleport cost

I have seen no issues with it.

Sandstorm - a range 2 fast zonal attack to primarily disrupt position/attacks, great against zonal control

I think it is fine.

Elfric's Life Ring - overcosted rubbish, please never waste space by printing this

A bit harsh I would say. To me it seemed lack luster.

Meditation Amulet - why this over Moonglow? Equipment has to be good competing in this slot. This is the card to make spawn points more competitive. The game values temporary denial of a fast action spell at 3 (Jinx). A 4-cost amulet that trades a full action for 4 mana may be considered in some spawn point builds (and solo FM). It's a full action burst not no-action persistent so needs a greater benefit.

I wanted different mana to action ratios.


Hurl Rock - fine cost-effect (avoidable unlike Arc / Flameblast) but a bit dull, still it fills an earth attack gap

Seems a small bit undercosted.

Akiro's Favour - ridiculously good and under-costed, needs "friendly creature" target if designed as a boon only else too versatile, fine at that cost (without Magebind) as a "may reveal to re-roll and discard" (so as timed bad luck mitigation) to make the game more skillful

I can agree with you on this.

Ballista - open to abuse with multiple sequential attacks without reply action, needs Unique (unrealistic, multiples needed for zonal control) or rule change to only allow 1 ready marker use before or after each action (the better solution as this removes HoB errata which then brings ToL back as a competitive option).

This has been under review for a while.

Bloodcrag Minotaur - fine for some future Charge-based build (e.g. "soldiers gain Fast and Elusive")

I think it is one of the most well rounded creatures.

Critical Strike - fine command enchantment that obsoletes Piercing Strike (most existing commands poor)

Gravikor - I finally view it and it's definitely great in some books but does not seem overpowered, just wary of making Iron Golems better in the current meta...

I like this alot but it is not OP

Hurl Meteorite - more Earth love with their Thunderbolt, very good with Wizard's Tower spell-switching utility

I think it may be too good

Lion Savagery - fine, with Minotaur it hints at a future Charge-based strategy (so Force Wave better etc)

Morning Star - fine but is it too much nerfing of Defence/Block/Reverse Attack with too much unavoidable?

Vorpal Blade - fine vanilla aggro, equal cost to versatile Mage Staff, will be popular but not overpowered

Temple High Guard - wow, very good but may be what Holy needs (so best guards with Guardian Angel), makes slam attacks even more tactical which is good

This is by far one of the best holy creature in the game.

Altar of Peace - missing control piece (split among 4 schools), mana denial boost, Epic so not overpowered

It can be OP if you build correctly, because it even affects attack spells.

Mordok's Tome - a cool card, suspect it flatters to deceive but nice flexibility, arcane mage only is in theme

I like this alot

Oscuda - more interesting than Dire Wolf, more armour hate (zonal critical), more Golem love (poison), reminds me that I suspect Screeching Harpy missed zonal and Psychic Immunity to make it competitive

This is a flavor card, but it does still have some use.

Clear Mind - psychic Purify, niche meta-dependent, a lot of unnecessary FM hate in these promo cards

It will be needed

Spiked Buckler - seems very good but probably not overpowered with Morning Star in the same set

This was the most fair version of this card. Used to read whenever you passed a defense roll. make this attack.

Altar of the Iron Guard - ok, this is poor design, it is far too cheap for a global effect and Legendary so the player going first gets a huge advantage. For that cost, you should delete "which you control, you may" to make it a benefit for both players. Global effect conjurations benefit both players ("just that I have more animals than you"). As a benefit for both players, one players who builds around it (Guardian Angel, Temple High Guard) will still gain more.

No comment

Debilitate - why this over Agony? Does not work with Charge. Maybe 1 copy for an enemy aggro mage? Please don't print this. Why not "this creature's attacks lose all keywords"? Now that would be a cool curse.

It is in place for some changes that may get made.

Holy Strike - why? It's not even a command. Divine Might may be played in an Incorporeal meta but this?

No comment

Plagued - a very interesting curse but more Iron Golem synergy, nice soft control to separate creatures

Woot more DoT spells. not overpowered
"Darth come prove to meet you are worthy of the fighting for your school in the arena and not just another scholar to be discarded like an worn out rag doll"


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sIKE

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Re: Feedback on Promo Cards
« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2013, 09:38:04 AM »

Ballista - open to abuse with multiple sequential attacks without reply action, needs Unique (unrealistic, multiples needed for zonal control) or rule change to only allow 1 ready marker use before or after each action (the better solution as this removes HoB errata which then brings ToL back as a competitive option).

This has been under review for a while.

- This is an interesting card it is both Over and Under Powered, which is going to make tuning it tough. On one hand two can be brought out at the end of a Mages Action Phase and QC each with a load token and then picks up one more load token during upkeep. If done during the other mages Initiative you can get off two shots without an chance for the other mage to respond to it. You then get 6 Dice with +3 Piercing  x 2 attacks for a cost of 16 mana. Basically like the ToL it(they) add additional actions in a mages round. So very awesome for a surprise attack. However there is a big down side. I play about a dozen games with them and then pulled them out of my book as a result. They are Slow!!!!! Once you get that volley off you have to wait 3 turns before you can use them again. I found that the Opposing Mage focused a bit on each one a turn and they were gone. I then added in Dwarf Panzergarde in to protect them. Which mostly worked. With 4 actions (2 Quick 2 Full) I spent 38 mana for nice attacks every three round after the initial surprise burst. The Guards were then (Wizard Tower) Surging Waved and then the Ballista fell any ways. 

- So with that all said maybe a bit over powered but I am not sure where to adjust. If the load token at casting is removed it is now worse than Akiro's Hammer as it will be so slow as to be useless. More mana cost? Too Slow for that cost. Reduce Piercing or Dice? Too slow for that cost. About the only thing I could see is increase it by a level so the book cost is only reasonable for a War school mage.

Bloodcrag Minotaur - fine for some future Charge-based build (e.g. "soldiers gain Fast and Elusive")

I think it is one of the most well rounded creatures.

 - Add Fast/Elusive and he is quite the critter

Hurl Meteorite - more Earth love with their Thunderbolt, very good with Wizard's Tower spell-switching utility

I think it may be too good

- Full Action balances it rather well, maybe (and just maybe) reduce dmg by 1 die

Temple High Guard - wow, very good but may be what Holy needs (so best guards with Guardian Angel), makes slam attacks even more tactical which is good

This is by far one of the best holy creature in the game.

- Add Holy Avenger in to a Pair...

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DeckBuilder

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Re: Feedback on Promo Cards
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2013, 10:53:21 AM »
Hurl Rock - fine cost-effect (avoidable unlike Arc / Flameblast) but a bit dull, still it fills an earth attack gap

Seems a small bit undercosted.

Hurl Meteorite - more Earth love with their Thunderbolt, very good with Wizard's Tower spell-switching utility

I think it may be too good

Altar of Peace - missing control piece (split among 4 schools), mana denial boost, Epic so not overpowered

It can be OP if you build correctly, because it even affects attack spells.

Yes, on reflection and comparative analysis, you are right on the earth attacks undercosting.

I did not appreciate the universality of Altar of Peace- good point.
I suggest a split on its effect into 2 different Epic conjurations:
Altar of Peace (Holy Epic) - pay 1 at declare step for melee attacks (ok for ranged and counterstrikes)
Sanctuary Tree (Nature Epic) - pay 1 at declare step for ranged attacks (ok for melee)
This then creates a very easy piece to insert into melee-only and ranged+guards builds
It also widens the Epic control pieces to 5 major schools (then add a War Epic for enchantment upkeep)
It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye. And then it's just fun.

baronzaltor

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Re: Feedback on Promo Cards
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2013, 07:32:52 PM »
Clear Mind/Wand of Healing is kind fun when used to knock the Stun marker off of a creature you just revealed Mind Control on, so you can put him to work that round.