September 16, 2019, 11:59:20 PM

Author Topic: Wildfire Imp & Teleport  (Read 4178 times)

Archwizard07

  • New Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 41
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« on: June 26, 2014, 08:23:28 AM »
So in reviewing the Wildfire Imp's teleport ability, am I correct in believing that it is without range or LoS limitations?

He can effectively teleport to any space in the arena if there is a burn marker?

jacksmack

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1068
  • Banana Stickers 19
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2014, 08:37:57 AM »
Correct.


No LOS required. Not limited by range.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2014, 09:35:32 AM by jacksmack »

Bluebaron

  • Full Mage
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2014, 08:38:38 AM »
The same rules as for the blue gremlin should apply. The answer therefore is no los needed.

see also rules supplement page 29

Laddinfance

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 4646
  • Banana Stickers 2
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2014, 08:43:22 AM »
Yes it is not limited by range.

No, it is not without line of sight. You have to target the zone you want to teleport to, and so you must have line of sight to it.

jacksmack

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1068
  • Banana Stickers 19
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2014, 09:05:06 AM »
Yes it is not limited by range.

No, it is not without line of sight. You have to target the zone you want to teleport to, and so you must have line of sight to it.

Impcard says:
Instead of taking a move action ........

Copy / Paste from rules and codex supplement - January 2014:

Teleport (the ability - not spell):
A creature which can move by Teleporting (such as Blue Gremlin and Grey Wraith) does not require LoS to an adjacent zone in order to Teleport there.

Laddinfance

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 4646
  • Banana Stickers 2
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #5 on: June 26, 2014, 09:13:08 AM »
Yes it is not limited by range.

No, it is not without line of sight. You have to target the zone you want to teleport to, and so you must have line of sight to it.

Impcard says:
Instead of taking a move action ........

Copy / Paste from rules and codex supplement - January 2014:

Teleport (the ability - not spell):
A creature which can move by Teleporting (such as Blue Gremlin and Grey Wraith) does not require LoS to an adjacent zone in order to Teleport there.

The card reads:

"Instead of taking a move action, Wildfire Imp may pay 1 mana to Teleport to a target zone with an object with a Burn condition on it."

The Grey Wraith and Blue Gremlin are different in the fact that they can simply teleport into an adjacent zone. For the Wildfire Imp he has to target where he's going. Anytime something asks for a target, it requires LOS.

Bluebaron

  • Full Mage
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2014, 09:20:09 AM »
That feels as an awkward ruling to me. Can you give us a reference from the rulebook or some other source?

Laddinfance

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 4646
  • Banana Stickers 2
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2014, 09:30:36 AM »
Page 17 of the Core Rules - Blocks Line of Sight (LoS)
"Abilities and spells cannot target any object or zone that is on the other side of a wall that blocks LoS."

I can appreciate the ambiguity. When designing this card I felt that "target" was a clearly defined term, but I can see where the wording of the previous ruling makes it sound as though "targeting" doesn't apply here. In order for the Wildfire Imp to teleport to a zone, he must target the zone, so if he does not have LoS to it then he is unable to teleport to that zone.

This is similar to the Teleport spell. Nothing about teleporting requires LoS, but the spell itself does because of it's target line. This is the same idea, his ability requires targeting.

Bluebaron

  • Full Mage
  • ***
  • Posts: 134
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2014, 09:36:44 AM »
Thanks

Laddinfance

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 4646
  • Banana Stickers 2
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2014, 09:40:50 AM »
Thank you all for bringing this up. I've been working on the Supplement update for FIF and this is an important question to answer.

jacksmack

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1068
  • Banana Stickers 19
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2014, 09:58:00 AM »
Its not similar to the Teleport incantation, because its all in the target bar with that spell.
One of the first things you learn in magewars is the target bar.

On the Imp the wording is downright horrible imo.
However - i went through alot of the cards with similar wording and often the 'target' refers to the target bar and therefor its implicit that it requires LOS because of the rules regarding the cast bar. ('minor healing' is an example of this)


According to this ruling enchantment transfusion must have LOS to the creature you wish to move enchantments to. I never thought of that.

On thorg the text says:
....... Place his taunt marker on target non-mage creature up to 1 zone away and in LOS.
Such inconsistencies allows for confusion. I can already see myself having to explain other players this who's initial impression is that the imp works like grey wrath or blue gremlin - that they are incorrect.

Staff of Beasts:
The wording on beast master staff says: "target an animal creature" which is targetting to me. Opposed to 'target zone' which is more like 'the target',  especially when its not 'the targetted'.

Considered how streamlined and well through-thought so many aspect of this game is, i strongly suggest you get the wording on your cards streamlined as well.
Its just so game breaking (as in no fun) when you are utterly screwed in a good game, because you slightly misinterpreted a minor detail in a rule.

Anyway. English is only my secondary language, so maybe this is much clearer to the native speakers.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2014, 11:13:53 AM by jacksmack »

ringkichard

  • Flightless Funpire
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2564
  • Banana Stickers 18
  • Kich, if you prefer.
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2014, 12:18:00 PM »
Magic the Gathering players especially are used to the importance of the word Target. In mage wars, Target always means LoS.
I can take the fun out of anything. It's true; here, look at this spreadsheet.

jacksmack

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1068
  • Banana Stickers 19
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2014, 12:22:21 PM »
In mage wars, Target always means LoS.

i learned that now :)

Shad0w

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2934
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #13 on: June 26, 2014, 04:02:57 PM »
Is this clear for everybody now?
"Darth come prove to meet you are worthy of the fighting for your school in the arena and not just another scholar to be discarded like an worn out rag doll"


Quote: Shad0w the Arcmage

silverclawgrizzly

  • Charlotte Mage Warrior
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2480
  • Banana Stickers 4
    • View Profile
Re: Wildfire Imp & Teleport
« Reply #14 on: June 26, 2014, 11:41:46 PM »
I would like to point out that JackSmack is now a Legendary Mage and only one of him may be in play at a time.

Also I'm really looking forward to playing Wildfire Imps.
  • Favourite Mage: Straywood Beastmaster
What we must all remember is no matter the game we were all newbies at one point.