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Author Topic: Tips for losing to new players  (Read 11246 times)

echephron

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Tips for losing to new players
« on: December 08, 2014, 05:41:27 PM »
A recent podcast about getting new ppl into mage wars tells you to not cream them the first time you play. I tried to put no thought into my strategy, but i still creamed the guy and apologized.

I want some tips on how to lose, but i still want to make it look like i am trying and show them good strategies to emulate and not make it obvious that i am trying to lose.

edit: I mean losing their first apprentice game.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2014, 06:04:25 PM by echephron »
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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2014, 06:05:58 PM »
A recent podcast about getting new ppl into mage wars tells you to not cream them the first time you play. I tried to put no thought into my strategy, but i still creamed the guy and apologized.

I want some tips on how to lose, but i still want to make it look like i am trying and show them good strategies to emulate and not make it obvious that i am trying to lose.
I typically when I play demo's do not play to win, but play to show how different traits and card 'items' work. So example, when I play the BM vs. the Warlock, I will bring out a Falcon attack with it to show them how Flying works. I will then have them put their creature on Guard and then attack again and show them how Guarding and Counterstrike will allow them to attack the Falcon. Typically I will then put on Regenerate on the Falcon and have them bring out a Darkfenne Bat and Lash of Hellfire. Show how Flying vs. Flying interacts and how Reach interacts with Flying. So typically I play not to lose, but play so they know how to win. Even if the play for me is sub-optimal it is worth it to be illustrative for the Padawan.   
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reddawn

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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2014, 07:59:36 PM »
The best situation you can present is a game between 2 new players, that way neither can accuse you of stomping them. 

If you don't have that luxury, just stick to simple spell interactions for the first few games, which shouldn't be hard given the apprentice decks. 
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silverclawgrizzly

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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2014, 10:08:36 PM »
Ok here are tips that have served me well:

1. Explain everything. If you make a move tell them why. "Ok I'm bringing my falcon up so it can attack next turn because it's Fast see?" That gets them to ask "What can I do to prevent that?" and lets you go into how to counter techniques, and when those counters work they also make your defeat more assured.

2. Build your mana needlessly. Cast Mana Crystals/Flowers for no reason. It's a good tactic to a point normally but there comes a time when you should be attacking and not building. Just make sure they start with attacking while you're still putting up infrastructure.

3. Go through their spell book with them before hand. "Oh Thorg here? Yeah he's awesome you wanna get him out quick." Tell them basic good advice before you even get started. Warlocks are awesome for this as "Go in there and set everything on fire" is a simple bouncing ball to follow. Likewise with a Beast Master "Have the Grizzly go murder peoples faces" is also pretty simple.

4. Attack their creatures, not their mage. Also attack their scrub creatures as opposed to their big threats. Kill Asyran Monks instead of Brogan. This lets you do them damage but keep their big guns in the fight.

5. Check to see if they have any questions every so often. A lot of times new players won't cast something awesome cause they don't know what the traits mean. Elusive? What's that? You mean I could have ignored your guards the whole time?

6. Don't cast the obvious counters to their tricks until later in the game when they have a solid lead. As above for example if they got guarding down pat then keep the Mongoose Agility in the book for a while. They're swarming? Don't put on a damage barrier just yet.

7. Teach them the joy of Wands and don't Dissolve them. Let them get the most out of their attack spells by spamming them on an Elemental Wand. Let em keep Teleporting you around with Mage Wands.

8. Cast weaker creatures than them and send yours in to die. Beast Master is good for this, especially against a Priestess using Knights or a Wizard with a Hydra.

9. Bring your mage into the fray early but don't attack much. Bring your mage forward and just cast equipment on them. If you do attack then go for their Mana Crystals and other secondary stuff. Attack a Mana Flower so you can explain Regenerate.

10. Don't even think in terms of strategy for yourself. Instead show off what makes the mage you're playing cool and let it go at that. Slap a curse or two on em if you're a Dark Mage, then explain why Dispel is your friend for example. The rest of the time just keep repeating that lesson after they've got down how to deal with it.

Your mileage may vary but these techniques have worked for me pretty well in the past.

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V10lentray

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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2014, 10:20:19 PM »

I want some tips on how to lose, but i still want to make it look like i am trying and show them good strategies to emulate and not make it obvious that i am trying to lose.

edit: I mean losing their first apprentice game.

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echephron

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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2014, 11:05:14 PM »
Thanks silverclaw grizzly
I like 4, 6, 8, and 9

What do i do to get them to stop building up creatures in the corner and attack me? I guess i could just charge my mage over there(aka 9).

I do have concerns that they will learn bad tactics from my actions.
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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2014, 11:58:15 PM »
Thanks silverclaw grizzly
I like 4, 6, 8, and 9

What do i do to get them to stop building up creatures in the corner and attack me? I guess i could just charge my mage over there(aka 9).

I do have concerns that they will learn bad tactics from my actions.
One of the things I have learned with minis players is to remind them that it is Mage Wars and the win condition is mage death not the number of creatures you kill.
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silverclawgrizzly

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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2014, 12:06:42 AM »
Thanks silverclaw grizzly
I like 4, 6, 8, and 9

What do i do to get them to stop building up creatures in the corner and attack me? I guess i could just charge my mage over there(aka 9).

I do have concerns that they will learn bad tactics from my actions.

What you can do with this actually is start pot shotting their critters and explain that success favors the bold :) Don't worry much about teaching them bad habits, if they get into the game and start playing regularly they'll figure out actual real tactics on their own. We all had bad tactics when we first started I imagine.
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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #8 on: December 09, 2014, 12:31:14 AM »
I do have concerns that they will learn bad tactics from my actions.

Don't worry, you can always stomp them later as part of their tactical and strategic education.  :P

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silverclawgrizzly

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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2014, 05:11:58 AM »
I do have concerns that they will learn bad tactics from my actions.

Don't worry, you can always stomp them later as part of their tactical and strategic education.  :P

Yeah pretty much lol.
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Sailor Vulcan

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Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2014, 08:36:10 PM »
what about using a worse spellbook? I wonder how much worse your own spellbook would have to be for them to stand a fighting chance against you when you're not trying to win. Making a large deliberate effort to lose is not necessarily gong to go unnoticed, especially if it's someone who knows you, right?
« Last Edit: December 09, 2014, 08:43:18 PM by Sailor Vulcan »
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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2014, 09:38:43 PM »
I'd rather try to win, but operate under some restriction or penalty, rather than actively trying to lose. Maybe start without any mana or something.
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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2014, 11:39:44 PM »
what about using a worse spellbook?

Yes, just use a standard spellbook :)
I consider it very challenging to play with them because important spells i often use are missing in most of these decks.

When playing with Newbies, i also cast attack spells on strong creatures with some armor to absorb, that survive the hit easily, just to show the side effects of spells, f.e. daze, slam or burn. That's a good way to burn your mana away ;)
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Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #13 on: December 10, 2014, 07:17:17 AM »
I'd rather try to win, but operate under some restriction or penalty, rather than actively trying to lose. Maybe start without any mana or something.

Before or after the first channeling phase? I'm thinking before, but not entirely sure.
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Re: Tips for losing to new players
« Reply #14 on: December 10, 2014, 03:44:18 PM »
I was thinking just miss the 10 starting mana, although that might not be a large enough disadvantage.
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