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Author Topic: Academy guarding rules clarification  (Read 3367 times)

reyda

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Academy guarding rules clarification
« on: March 11, 2016, 05:02:06 PM »
In Academy, when a guard decides to ignore an attacking Pest enemy, is the Counterstrike Step skipped? More specifically, if a Pest creature attacks a guarding Ridgeback Skunk, and the guard chooses to ignore the little bugger and save his guard token, does the attacker still receive a stagger condition?

Halewijn

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2016, 10:43:20 AM »
Since the counterstrike step happens whether or not you actually make a counterstrike and the skunks card does not specify that it needs to make an attack, the attacker will still receive a stagger marker.  :)
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Halewijn

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2016, 10:46:20 AM »
In addition to this: the skunk doesn't even need to guard. Whenever it's attacked, it will give the opponent a stagger marker.
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DaveW

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2016, 04:53:38 PM »
Can guards choose to not counterstrike Pest attackers? I don't remember seeing that before. From the sound of it, the guard would not lose their guard marker if so. Is that how it works? Thanks!
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Halewijn

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2016, 04:55:20 PM »
indeed. Only in academy though. The rule makes so much sense and is awesome I would prefer it would be added in arena too!
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DaveW

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2016, 07:02:34 PM »
indeed. Only in academy though. The rule makes so much sense and is awesome I would prefer it would be added in arena too!

Great... now we have different functional rules between Academy and Arena. This can not be a good thing.
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Zuberi

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2016, 09:15:27 PM »
There are several functional differences. They are different games.

exid

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2016, 01:34:09 AM »
i never played academy... i understand that when a pest creature attacks, it must atttack the guard, but the guard can ignore it: no couterstrike, no guard counter removing.

i agree that it would be simpler if all the functionnalities would be the same (for siituations that occure in both games, of cours).
but why is this pest-guard rule better than the arena one?

in a game point of view, this rule makes the pests weaker. are they too powerfull in arena?
in a background point of view, the guard is occupying the zone, so all cratures must attack it, after an attack the guard had to concentrate on the attack so the zone is free for other creatures. why would the guard be able to ignore a little creature more than a big one?

Halewijn

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2016, 06:37:03 AM »
when Fellella, Pixie Familiar attacks you with her little blast, you just ignore it, let her tiny attack hit you, and keep your eyes on the big dangerous golem in the zone. That's how I imagine it.
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iNano78

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2016, 06:46:55 AM »
i never played academy... i understand that when a pest creature attacks, it must atttack the guard, but the guard can ignore it: no couterstrike, no guard counter removing.

i agree that it would be simpler if all the functionnalities would be the same (for siituations that occure in both games, of cours).
but why is this pest-guard rule better than the arena one?

in a game point of view, this rule makes the pests weaker. are they too powerfull in arena?
in a background point of view, the guard is occupying the zone, so all cratures must attack it, after an attack the guard had to concentrate on the attack so the zone is free for other creatures. why would the guard be able to ignore a little creature more than a big one?

For exactly the reason you describe. If I'm guarding a zone and there's a giant ogre with a club ready to strike me, and there's a ferret with 2 teeth, and the ferret bites me in the ankle, do you really expect me to turn my back on the ogre to swing at the ferret and exhaust myself on the process? Personally I'd hope I have the fortitude to ignore the ferret bite and keep my attention on the ogre.

So... perhaps it isn't a "better" rule (as you mention, I don't think anybody thought pests were overpowered in Arena), but it makes a lot of sense thematically.

As for rules differences, there are several, most notably (1) No planning phase (you fetch a spell immediately before playing it), and (2) no quickcast phases (so you can play a full action + quickcast to end a round, then have initiative and take a full action + another quickcast, all before your opponent has an opportunity to take even a quickcast let alone a full action).

Oh, and everything happens in the same zone, so guarding and eliminating guards (by hitting them or by Staggering them or by making them Pests via Shrink, etc) is really important.
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exid

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2016, 08:19:32 AM »
For exactly the reason you describe. If I'm guarding a zone and there's a giant ogre with a club ready to strike me, and there's a ferret with 2 teeth, and the ferret bites me in the ankle, do you really expect me to turn my back on the ogre to swing at the ferret and exhaust myself on the process? Personally I'd hope I have the fortitude to ignore the ferret bite and keep my attention on the ogre.
but you could want to exterminate the ferret first... in this idea (i can choose) the best rull would be: the guard can decide for every creature if he wants to focus on it or not... but then the guard would be too powerfull!

So... perhaps it isn't a "better" rule (as you mention, I don't think anybody thought pests were overpowered in Arena), but it makes a lot of sense thematically.
for me the power balance should be the first question.

Laddinfance

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2016, 08:24:30 AM »
We changed guard to ensure that it's a valid and strong mechanic. In a single zone game it was often very easy to "knock someone" off guard. By allowing you to "ignore" pests, your opponent has to make a meaningful choice on how to remove that guard.

Just a bit of insight.

Halewijn

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2016, 08:29:09 AM »
but you could want to exterminate the ferret first... in this idea (i can choose) the best rull would be: the guard can decide for every creature if he wants to focus on it or not... but then the guard would be too powerfull!

If a pest creature attacks you, you still MAY counterstrike. You can actually choose for pest creatures.

We changed guard to ensure that it's a valid and strong mechanic. In a single zone game it was often very easy to "knock someone" off guard. By allowing you to "ignore" pests, your opponent has to make a meaningful choice on how to remove that guard.

Just a bit of insight.

Yes, I've noticed this and I completely agree. If the small cubs in academy would actually force the opponent to lose it's guard marker those bear books would be overpowered.

The pest-trait on the cubs is the only reason they are balanced. (2 armor+5 life for 4 mana)
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Halewijn

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2016, 08:35:58 AM »
Also, the adjustment of the rules would only affect zombie builds (in particular the venomous zombie & zombies are really strong anyway). The other pest-creatures rarely get used for attacking. With all the new pest creatures from academy, this actually might become an issue later on.
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DaveW

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Re: Academy guarding rules clarification
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2016, 01:41:22 PM »
There are several functional differences. They are different games.

We can still use the spells in Academy, right? That's why I bought the thing, anyway.
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