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Author Topic: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists  (Read 2032 times)

Anubis

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Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« on: June 13, 2016, 03:57:37 PM »
Dear Mage Warriors!

I need your help to start an interesting project!

As we already discussed in many threads, lots of players don't especially like deckbuilding, or they don't have enough time allowed to play, or they just are bad at it. Some of my gaming friends are like that, they google a random list and try to play it, without knowing how...

That would be the role of this document (that I like to thing being available as a ressource on Arcane Wonders webpage) which would contain a guide to deckbuilding and one, two or three very different decklists for each mage, with a general overview for each list, how to play it, the key cards, and two different ouvertures (three first turns...) as well as a description on how to use the mages specific abilities.

Are you interested to participate?

I think for starting everyone can post decklists here with small descriptions. I'll gather them in the next post...
« Last Edit: June 13, 2016, 03:59:42 PM by Anubis »
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results...

Anubis

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2016, 03:58:01 PM »
- Reserved for decklists gathering -
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results...

Anubis

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2016, 03:58:24 PM »
- Reserved for deckbuilding guide -
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results...

Coshade

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2016, 05:05:02 PM »
This sounds like a really interesting idea. I'd be happy to contribute some books for any mage you need. I would also suggest checking out this thread ---> http://forum.arcanewonders.com/index.php?topic=14728.0

The library of the White Spires are generally recognized good books. Often they have pretty good descriptions on how to use them as well.
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Tyrnan

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2016, 02:52:49 PM »
I like the idea very much. There have been several posts about deckbuilding in the forums. Zuberi started to write a guide that got published in the blog of Lord of Winter (http://magewars.weebly.com/general-discussion/building-a-spellbook-part-1) but it seems that only part 1 and part 2 (just replace the 1 with 2 in the link) ever got published.

There is a very good beginners guide to building spell books in the german forums written by schwenkgott (http://www.foren.pegasus.de/foren/topic/24016-das-eigene-deck-eine-gro%C3%9Fe-herausforderung-einsteigerguide/). In fact its the most comprehensive one I know of. Maybe schwenk (or someone else with his permission) could translate it for this forum.

So maybe this is a good opportunity to gather the gems in the forum and include them here in repolished form.
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Halewijn

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #5 on: June 15, 2016, 10:02:41 AM »
Translating Schenkgott might be gold to start.

In general I think I follow the following steps:

Step 1: Pick a mage.

If you are not familiar with the options, look up the mages and their respective tactics and strengths/weaknesses.

Step 2: Pick a theme/strategy/card around which your deck is designed.
It is very important that you choose a card or a theme which your mage will use as the main goal to kill the opponent. After you have decided what you want, you should try to include all cards necessary to support this strategy. Question yourself what is necessary to keep your strategy going. The trick here is to only add cards needed for your strategy. If you add every card that might be helpful than you will have way too many cards.

Examples:

Warlock, Sectarus: Include a battle forge, enough curses, something to increase the strength of your mage.

Beastmaster, Animal Kinship: You need enough cheap creatures to keep the kinship effects going. Probably a lair to summon them.

Warlord, Talos: Include many outposts so you are sure to summon talos. Try to get a good mix between level 1 and level 2 creatures. In the beginning you are short in mana so the small ones are preferable while after a couple of rounds it is probably better to summon more durable creatures. Include the dwarf panzerguard to guard outposts.

Step 3: Cover your decks weaknesses.

This is probably the hardest step during spellbook creation since it is not always easy to predict possible counters against you. With practice you will become better at this. After you have played with your deck you can always adjust a few cards to improve this.

Some (but far from all) common weaknesses:

Movement/positioning: Especially Solo/buddy builds need enough positioning and movement cards since every hit with your strong creature counts. Cards like force push/teleport/charge/Mongoose Agility/cheetah speed and even walls can help you with this.

Flying: If you don't have many flying creatures and don't plan to use many attack spells it might be wise to either include one flying creature, eagle wings, maim wings or gravikor. Especially druids and necromancers have problems against flyers.

Rushes: If you have a slow startup, make sure you have at least some (cheap) means to protect you at the start of a game. Common used cards are Defend, Intercepting creatures, walls, Brace yourself, and many more.

Mana drainage: Especially swarms have problems with mana and they can be drained even more easily with cards like Suppression Orb and Mordok's Obelisk. Either add more economy cards, a Mana Prism or make sure to have some means to take out conjurations like that. (1 or 2 rounds)

Step 4: Include a backup strategy

Imagine that your strategy will not work for any reason at all. Think of a secondary tactic you can use if all else fails. Preferably this strategy uses many of the same cards as your main strategy but in a different way. This is of course not always possible.

Examples:

Spawnpoint is destroyed, no swarm possible: Include one or two very big creatures and change your strategy more into a buddy build.

Your deck is based on tainted or poison and you face a necromancer.

You want to use fire but the opponent is using too much fire protection for you to handle.

Step 5: Include some staple cards.

Not all of these cards are per sé necessary, but make sure you checked anyway.

- Dispel/disperse/etc... A must in every deck.
- Dissolve/Crumble/etc...
- Some Positioning/movement cards
- Walls
- Some fire protection: Without it, the adramelech can potentially destroy you.
- Healing: not every deck needs healing, but just remember bleed. Without healing this can be devistating
- Purify
- Armor: Every mage should add some degree of armor. Defences are very nice, but wall of thornes is unforgiving.
- Means against armor: If the opponent has 4 armor and you are not using spells like "Ghoul rot" your damage output can be very low. Keep in mind that there are cards like defences, Voltaric shield, healing, regeneration, ... that can make this problem even larger. Common spells: Dissolve, Disperse, Acid ball, Rust, or a creature that causes corrodes.
- Some attack spells: Every mage needs a few attack spells. Not every strategy uses a lot of them but reserve at least 8 spellbookpoints for attack spells.

Optional Step 6: Add a card you really want to try out but probably won't need

Since it's still a game designed to have fun, I suggest to have at least a few cards you will almost never use but are just very cool. Granted, it will not improve the strength of your deck in most situations. But if you ever do have the chance to use it, it can give you a huge boost and it is just super fun!
« Last Edit: June 15, 2016, 10:29:39 AM by Halewijn »
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Ravepig

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2016, 04:12:35 PM »
Translating Schenkgott might be gold to start.

In general I think I follow the following steps:

Step 1: Pick a mage.

If you are not familiar with the options, look up the mages and their respective tactics and strengths/weaknesses.

Step 2: Pick a theme/strategy/card around which your deck is designed.
It is very important that you choose a card or a theme which your mage will use as the main goal to kill the opponent. After you have decided what you want, you should try to include all cards necessary to support this strategy. Question yourself what is necessary to keep your strategy going. The trick here is to only add cards needed for your strategy. If you add every card that might be helpful than you will have way too many cards.

Examples:

Warlock, Sectarus: Include a battle forge, enough curses, something to increase the strength of your mage.

Beastmaster, Animal Kinship: You need enough cheap creatures to keep the kinship effects going. Probably a lair to summon them.

Warlord, Talos: Include many outposts so you are sure to summon talos. Try to get a good mix between level 1 and level 2 creatures. In the beginning you are short in mana so the small ones are preferable while after a couple of rounds it is probably better to summon more durable creatures. Include the dwarf panzerguard to guard outposts.

Step 3: Cover your decks weaknesses.

This is probably the hardest step during spellbook creation since it is not always easy to predict possible counters against you. With practice you will become better at this. After you have played with your deck you can always adjust a few cards to improve this.

Some (but far from all) common weaknesses:

Movement/positioning: Especially Solo/buddy builds need enough positioning and movement cards since every hit with your strong creature counts. Cards like force push/teleport/charge/Mongoose Agility/cheetah speed and even walls can help you with this.

Flying: If you don't have many flying creatures and don't plan to use many attack spells it might be wise to either include one flying creature, eagle wings, maim wings or gravikor. Especially druids and necromancers have problems against flyers.

Rushes: If you have a slow startup, make sure you have at least some (cheap) means to protect you at the start of a game. Common used cards are Defend, Intercepting creatures, walls, Brace yourself, and many more.

Mana drainage: Especially swarms have problems with mana and they can be drained even more easily with cards like Suppression Orb and Mordok's Obelisk. Either add more economy cards, a Mana Prism or make sure to have some means to take out conjurations like that. (1 or 2 rounds)

Step 4: Include a backup strategy

Imagine that your strategy will not work for any reason at all. Think of a secondary tactic you can use if all else fails. Preferably this strategy uses many of the same cards as your main strategy but in a different way. This is of course not always possible.

Examples:

Spawnpoint is destroyed, no swarm possible: Include one or two very big creatures and change your strategy more into a buddy build.

Your deck is based on tainted or poison and you face a necromancer.

You want to use fire but the opponent is using too much fire protection for you to handle.

Step 5: Include some staple cards.

Not all of these cards are per sé necessary, but make sure you checked anyway.

- Dispel/disperse/etc... A must in every deck.
- Dissolve/Crumble/etc...
- Some Positioning/movement cards
- Walls
- Some fire protection: Without it, the adramelech can potentially destroy you.
- Healing: not every deck needs healing, but just remember bleed. Without healing this can be devistating
- Purify
- Armor: Every mage should add some degree of armor. Defences are very nice, but wall of thornes is unforgiving.
- Means against armor: If the opponent has 4 armor and you are not using spells like "Ghoul rot" your damage output can be very low. Keep in mind that there are cards like defences, Voltaric shield, healing, regeneration, ... that can make this problem even larger. Common spells: Dissolve, Disperse, Acid ball, Rust, or a creature that causes corrodes.
- Some attack spells: Every mage needs a few attack spells. Not every strategy uses a lot of them but reserve at least 8 spellbookpoints for attack spells.

Optional Step 6: Add a card you really want to try out but probably won't need

Since it's still a game designed to have fun, I suggest to have at least a few cards you will almost never use but are just very cool. Granted, it will not improve the strength of your deck in most situations. But if you ever do have the chance to use it, it can give you a huge boost and it is just super fun!

I'm printing this off and handing out copies to my little gaming group. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
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Halewijn

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2016, 04:33:05 PM »
Glad you like it  ;D

I'm sure with the input of other great players on the forum this tread can become a great guide for every non-hardcore player. (If someone wants to edit or add parts in my text, please do!  ;) )
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Anubis

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2016, 03:33:32 PM »
Sorry for not having posted for some time... Here I am again...

I really like your guide Halewijn.

I will right now message Schwenkgott, to know if he agrees to let me translate some of his very good (and very long) german posts and use them here. If he agrees I will copy it in the reserved subject above and you'll see the translation process going (so you'll be able to correct my bad english)

For decklists I'll use those from LoWS first, but we'll need some other lists to give players a wider choice...
However beautiful the strategy, you should occasionally look at the results...

Tyrnan

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2016, 04:33:06 PM »
Hey Anubis,
if you get Schwenk's permission I would be glad to help you with the translation. Just contact me via PN if you would like me to help.
Regarding spellbooks we should certainly include all winning books from GenCon and German Nationals and other Tourneys that had some significant amount of participants. Including the Thunderdomes and the recent ADMW Tournament on OCTGN.
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Zuberi

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Re: Deckbuilding Handbook & Decklists
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2016, 08:55:19 PM »
I like the idea very much. There have been several posts about deckbuilding in the forums. Zuberi started to write a guide that got published in the blog of Lord of Winter (http://magewars.weebly.com/general-discussion/building-a-spellbook-part-1) but it seems that only part 1 and part 2 (just replace the 1 with 2 in the link) ever got published.

There is a very good beginners guide to building spell books in the german forums written by schwenkgott (http://www.foren.pegasus.de/foren/topic/24016-das-eigene-deck-eine-gro%C3%9Fe-herausforderung-einsteigerguide/). In fact its the most comprehensive one I know of. Maybe schwenk (or someone else with his permission) could translate it for this forum.

So maybe this is a good opportunity to gather the gems in the forum and include them here in repolished form.

I did indeed do something similar, and I'm sorry if the final parts didn't get posted. There was a big delay for them being written, a lot of life things came up, but I did eventually get them sent to Lord0fWinter. My guide ended up being very close to Schwenkgott's. Step one involved picking your mage and your winning strategy. Step two was shoring up your weaknesses. Step three was including spells and variant strategies to allow adaptability. Step four was trimming down to the legal spell point limit.

So the main difference was Shwenkgott anticipates having points left over, and I anticipate needing to trim things back down, lol.