August 12, 2020, 09:07:22 PM

Author Topic: Wizards Tower rush  (Read 4297 times)

Reddicediaries

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1095
  • Banana Stickers 1
  • Out of the ashes, a new power will rise.
    • View Profile
Wizards Tower rush
« on: June 24, 2016, 08:28:33 AM »
So has anyone realized that the wizard's tower double move turn one means you cant use it. You have to use your qc to cast the tower. I've seen a lot of mistakes during for this playstyle.
The Phoenix shall rise.

Sailor Vulcan

  • Secret Identity: Imaginator
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 3130
  • Banana Stickers 3
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2016, 08:39:41 AM »
Yes you can. The tower is a familiar, so can cast spells without using the mage's action.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster
I am Sailor Vulcan! Champion of justice and reason! And yes, I am already aware my uniform is considered flashy, unprofessional, and borderline sexually provocative for my species by most intelligent lifeforms. I did not choose this outfit. Shut up.

Kaarin

  • Sr. Mage
  • ****
  • Posts: 388
  • Banana Stickers 2
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2016, 08:56:49 AM »
It's possible, because as opposed to Quickcast WT isn't required to be used immediately before or after activation. So there's a time window for using conjuration(s) before QC before activation or after QC after activation.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2016, 09:00:56 AM by Kaarin »
  • Favourite Mage: Bloodwave Warlord
OCTGN: Wstrzasniety (UTC+2)

iNano78

  • Ambassador
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1290
  • Banana Stickers 4
  • Playing at the Royal Canadian Legion in Ottawa
    • View Profile
    • Ottawa/Gatineau Mage Wars (FB group)
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2016, 10:16:43 AM »
It's possible, because as opposed to Quickcast WT isn't required to be used immediately before or after activation. So there's a time window for using conjuration(s) before QC before activation or after QC after activation.

Wizard's Tower is specific though: "before or after any friendly activation phase."



The question is how soon after an activation phase are you allowed to use it.  If you activate your Wizard (double-move), then quickcast Wizard's Tower, is it too late to activate Wizard's Tower because the window after a friendly activation ended when the quickcast began?  I think the answer is "no" (or at least, that's how it's usually ruled, because players do this routinely) but the reason isn't obvious.
  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster

Reddicediaries

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1095
  • Banana Stickers 1
  • Out of the ashes, a new power will rise.
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2016, 10:26:47 AM »
I nano is right. You cant double move and cast withought fast
The Phoenix shall rise.

Reddicediaries

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1095
  • Banana Stickers 1
  • Out of the ashes, a new power will rise.
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2016, 10:34:32 AM »
We should ask Silverclaw grizzly.
The Phoenix shall rise.

Kaarin

  • Sr. Mage
  • ****
  • Posts: 388
  • Banana Stickers 2
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2016, 11:10:18 AM »
It's possible, because as opposed to Quickcast WT isn't required to be used immediately before or after activation. So there's a time window for using conjuration(s) before QC before activation or after QC after activation.

Wizard's Tower is specific though: "before or after any friendly activation phase."
It's not specific enough.
There's precedent that "before or after any friendly creature's Action Phase" (Hand of Bim-Shalla, first printing) conjurations can be used before/after other such conjurations/QC. It's only QC that has "immediately". Before errata to cards it was possible to use multiple Hands of Bim-Shalla to gain multiple melee+1 bonuses. You could argue that one use of HBM wasn't before friendly creature's Action Phase, but before use of other HBM.

before/after or immediately before/after?
When I started playing MW I assumed that whenever "before or after any friendly creature's action phase..." is stated on a card it was supposed to mean immediately before/after that action phase (just like it's in QuickCast's description). It wasn't until friend used Temple of Light and Hand of Bim-Shalla (or two HBS; it was long time ago) before his action phase that I got to know correct rule. I simply assumed that his use of ToL was before him using HBS, and not action phase in game terms.
  • Favourite Mage: Bloodwave Warlord
OCTGN: Wstrzasniety (UTC+2)

Coshade

  • Arcane Duels Host
  • Administrator
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1908
  • Banana Stickers 6
    • View Profile
    • Arcane Duels!
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2016, 11:33:57 AM »
You are allowed to activate multiple conjurations at the end or before a friendly creatures action phase. Quick casts can be considered in that realm as well.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2016, 11:51:40 AM by Coshade »
  • Favourite Mage: Malakai Priest

Reddicediaries

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1095
  • Banana Stickers 1
  • Out of the ashes, a new power will rise.
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2016, 12:36:49 PM »
Then why did silverclaw make the ruling he did in gen con?
The Phoenix shall rise.

Coshade

  • Arcane Duels Host
  • Administrator
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1908
  • Banana Stickers 6
    • View Profile
    • Arcane Duels!
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2016, 12:48:17 PM »
Then why did silverclaw make the ruling he did in gen con?

There was a misunderstanding.I wouldn't blame Silverclaw for any of it. He's one of the best judges I've seen in competitive gaming.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2016, 12:53:41 PM by Coshade »
  • Favourite Mage: Malakai Priest

Reddicediaries

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1095
  • Banana Stickers 1
  • Out of the ashes, a new power will rise.
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2016, 01:44:02 PM »
So you're saying he made a wrong call at gen con?
The Phoenix shall rise.

Puddnhead

  • Member of Arcane Duels; MageCast Co-host
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 1543
  • Banana Stickers 7
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2016, 02:08:58 PM »
So you're saying he made a wrong call at gen con?

It was clarified after the tournament that the ruling was incorrect and that you ARE allowed to use conjurations after an action + quickcast.  I believe the card text in question (Wizard's Tower) was a reason for the confusion, but it has been specifically addressed by Laddinfance.

Given that the illustrious Mr. Silverclawgrizzly will be judging again this year, you can bet the ruling will be quite well understood and implemented for GenCon 2016.
  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster

Reddicediaries

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1095
  • Banana Stickers 1
  • Out of the ashes, a new power will rise.
    • View Profile
Re: Wizards Tower rush
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2016, 03:00:45 PM »
I'm, thanks for the clarification. BTW,  coshade, will ad be recording any of the gen con games?
The Phoenix shall rise.