August 03, 2020, 06:57:19 AM

Author Topic: Master and Apprentice  (Read 5869 times)

Zuberi

  • Rules Guru
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2504
  • Banana Stickers 57
    • View Profile
Master and Apprentice
« on: June 29, 2016, 12:14:46 PM »
This idea was inspired by Sailor Vulcan's post here.

This format will be identical to normal Arena Play except as mentioned.

Setup
Each player will start with two Mages; one of which must be a Mage from Academy. Forward, these mages shall be referred to as Master and Apprentice, with the Apprentice being the Academy Mage. Each Mage will have it's own accompanying spellbook, with separate spellpoint counts as limited by their Mage Ability Cards. Both are allowed to use any spells legal in Arena.

When setting up the game, both Mages that one player controls shall begin in the same zone. Their Apprentice gets their own Action Marker but does not get a Quick Cast Marker. You will need a separate status board for each Mage. The dials provided in Academy may work, but being an Arena game you should be aware that changes to Life and Channeling values are possible which aren't tracked on the dials.

Game Play
During the Planning Stage, you will prepare 2 spells for your Master from the Master's Spellbook, and 1 spell for the Apprentice from the Apprentice's Spellbook. Each Mage must use their own mana supply to cast their prepared spells. For familiars and spawnpoints that cast spells, if they can't provide the entirety of the spell's mana cost themselves, then the remainder may come from either of your two mages regardless of which one first cast the Familiar or Spawnpoint.

Victory
The goal of the game is to kill both of your opponent's Mages. If your Apprentice is killed, you lose access to the Apprentice's Spellbook. Your Master continues to prepare 2 spells from their own spellbook each round. Similarly, if your Master is killed, you lose access to the Master's Spellbook. Your Apprentice continues to prepare only 1 spell from their own spellbook each round. Nothing happens to the cards in play whenever a mage is killed. The bond between Apprentice and Master is so strong, that they can take over each others spells. Any objects attached to the slain mage though are of course discarded.

Zuberi

  • Rules Guru
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2504
  • Banana Stickers 57
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #1 on: June 29, 2016, 12:17:43 PM »
This has not been tested any yet, and thinking about it some more, games may run a bit long. May change the victory condition to just killing your opponent's Master Mage.

Coshade

  • Arcane Duels Host
  • Administrator
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1908
  • Banana Stickers 6
    • View Profile
    • Arcane Duels!
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #2 on: June 29, 2016, 03:09:45 PM »
This sounds like a lot of fun! Thanks Zuberi.
  • Favourite Mage: Malakai Priest

Sailor Vulcan

  • Secret Identity: Imaginator
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 3130
  • Banana Stickers 3
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2016, 04:01:23 PM »
This has not been tested any yet, and thinking about it some more, games may run a bit long. May change the victory condition to just killing your opponent's Master Mage.

Why not make the win condition killing the apprentice mage?
  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster
I am Sailor Vulcan! Champion of justice and reason! And yes, I am already aware my uniform is considered flashy, unprofessional, and borderline sexually provocative for my species by most intelligent lifeforms. I did not choose this outfit. Shut up.

iNano78

  • Ambassador
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 1290
  • Banana Stickers 4
  • Playing at the Royal Canadian Legion in Ottawa
    • View Profile
    • Ottawa/Gatineau Mage Wars (FB group)
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2016, 04:09:28 PM »
This has not been tested any yet, and thinking about it some more, games may run a bit long. May change the victory condition to just killing your opponent's Master Mage.

Why not make the win condition killing the apprentice mage?

Because the Apprentice is more like a glorified Familiar.  I could be wrong, but Zuberi's Master + Apprentice sound like they're designed more for 1-on-1 than team play.  But you could probably use it as a teaching tool, making a new player your Apprentice... which is pretty thematic, actually (assuming the new player is inclined to see it that way, rather than feeling patronized).

I like the idea of "kill the Master" as the goal.  Otherwise, if you are playing teams, it's no fun if an Apprentice dies and has to sit out while the match could continue for quite some time.  And if a Master dies and Apprentice continues alone (in team or one-on-one play), the outcome is likely inevitable given how much more fragile an Apprentice is.  So killing the Master should be the goal, and if you choose to go after the Apprentice, that's purely optional (similar to taking out a familiar along the way to indirectly weaken the Master).  And this works particularly well for teaching a new player by making them an Apprentice, since you should generally try to avoid killing off the new player to maximize their enjoyment... in principle.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2016, 04:21:34 PM by iNano78 »
  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster

Zuberi

  • Rules Guru
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2504
  • Banana Stickers 57
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2016, 08:42:38 PM »
Yeah, I intended it for 1 person to be controlling both the Master and the Apprentice. It is kind of like a super familiar. Thinking about it more, I think Student might be a better term to use though to avoid confusion with Apprentice Mode. I'll admit I was influenced by the Dark Side of the force and the Sith rule of two when thinking this up. I'm glad to hear other people find this idea interesting. My spouse and I are planning on trying it out sometime, probably this weekend, but I'd love to hear how it works for other people.

bigfatchef

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 603
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2016, 03:49:24 AM »
This seems thematically perfect to me.
From a gaming perspective I guess having to kill the master is the way to go as mentioned. I would think the main problem in the game is, that ghe apprentice only has limited spells due to his smaller amount of sbp available. So the longer the game gets, the more limited the apprentice will get. Thematically you could see the apprentice has reached his limig of concentration, still is able to punch around.

Boocheck

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2108
  • Banana Stickers 3
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2016, 04:49:51 AM »
This could be a very fun way how to introduce Mage Wars to someone. What i am afraid is a time needed for one full length game.

I would probably add a rule that Mage cannot gain an apprentice that is from his triple cost school. Priestes tutoring necromancer seems funny :)
  • Favourite Mage: Bloodwave Warlord
I am one with the force, the force is with me! (Warlord is still my fav mage ;) )

Zuberi

  • Rules Guru
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2504
  • Banana Stickers 57
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2016, 12:06:38 PM »
This could be a very fun way how to introduce Mage Wars to someone. What i am afraid is a time needed for one full length game.

I would probably add a rule that Mage cannot gain an apprentice that is from his triple cost school. Priestes tutoring necromancer seems funny :)

Priestess rescued a young lad from a cult of Necromancers and is attempting to turn him back towards the light. Could make a good story.

Quote from: bigfatchef
. I would think the main problem in the game is, that ghe apprentice only has limited spells due to his smaller amount of sbp available.

That's a big reason why the Apprentice, or Student, doesn't get a Quick Cast Marker. Being limited to only casting one spell per round at most should help slow down how quick he goes through his book. It still needs playtesting, but I doubt he goes through the entire book. How limited his choices become though remains to be seen.

bigfatchef

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 603
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2016, 01:49:15 PM »

Quote from: bigfatchef
. I would think the main problem in the game is, that ghe apprentice only has limited spells due to his smaller amount of sbp available.

That's a big reason why the Apprentice, or Student, doesn't get a Quick Cast Marker. Being limited to only casting one spell per round at most should help slow down how quick he goes through his book. It still needs playtesting, but I doubt he goes through the entire book. How limited his choices become though remains to be seen.

I didn't see this part. That is indeed a good way to handle it. But it needs testing

Milevan_Faent

  • Full Mage
  • ***
  • Posts: 173
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2016, 08:35:55 AM »
I kind of want to test this out... It seems like an interesting concept.

Halewijn

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 1786
  • Banana Stickers 6
    • View Profile
Re: Master and Apprentice
« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2016, 09:12:07 AM »
I want to try this too!

This has not been tested any yet, and thinking about it some more, games may run a bit long. May change the victory condition to just killing your opponent's Master Mage.

Why not make the win condition killing the apprentice mage?

I totally agree with vulcan and think "kill the apprentice" might be better and more fun to make both mages important and not like a familiar. Like in all animes, the master has to protect his apprentice at all cost. (Even casting equipment on him). Games will also be faster.

If the master is not protecting himself it is still a good idea to kill him. Without the master, the apprentice will most likely die.

"Kill the master" = Arena + strong, disposable pet.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 09:14:32 AM by Halewijn »
  • Favourite Mage: Bloodwave Warlord
When in doubt kill it with fire? I never doubt and crush them right away.