December 17, 2017, 02:06:54 AM

Author Topic: Titanodon  (Read 1554 times)

Kharhaz

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2005
  • Banana Stickers 5
    • View Profile
Re: Titanodon
« Reply #30 on: July 31, 2017, 08:53:41 PM »
Personally this should not be able to be effected by Counterstrikes and the like due to timing.

This attack only occurs upon a card leaving a zone and once it has made the attack it is no longer in the zone there it made the attack. Therefore any damage causing elements that generate from opposing effects cannot target this card as it is no longer at the range of 0-0 that these effects happen under, hence it cannot be effected by a counterstrike, etc. However it should be treated as an attack in that zone when interfacing with other rules elements, such as guards.

On the note of flying trample then it should lose the flying trait to make a trample attack against creatures that do not have the flying trait. This then covers the thematic of a swooping attack. Against flying creatures it does not lose the flying trait as the same combat happens the 3D aerial dynamic battlefield (think dogfights of WW2).

Leaving the zone is step 3 and actually moving the card into the new zone is not until step 5 so the trample is still made while the creature is in the zone.

Even stranger example is that a wall could prevent the creature from moving into the new zone after the trample attack is made since the order is:

step 3 trample effect ->
step 4 wall attack (theoretically producing a stun or some other effect that prevents movement) ->

and then the move ends with the trample creature never actually leaving the zone.

Sailor Vulcan

  • Secret Identity: Imaginator
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 2915
  • Banana Stickers 3
    • View Profile
Re: Titanodon
« Reply #31 on: August 03, 2017, 12:11:56 PM »
I think that a trample attack should be a kind of melee attack, just like zone attacks are a kind of ranged attack. It doesn't really make sense thematically for trample to not be melee.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk

  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster
I am Sailor Vulcan! Champion of justice and reason! And yes, I am already aware my uniform is considered flashy, unprofessional, and borderline sexually provocative for my species by most intelligent lifeforms. I did not choose this outfit. Shut up.

Zuberi

  • Acolyte of the Dice Gods
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2412
  • Banana Stickers 52
    • View Profile
Re: Titanodon
« Reply #32 on: August 03, 2017, 01:46:33 PM »
There are a lot of things that modify and interact with melee attacks, which we don't want affecting Trample. Not just dice increases, but also things like Battle Fury. It was a considerably varied list, so it was decided that the best thing to do to prevent all of it was to make it not count as a melee attack.

It seems that this may have thrown the baby out with the bath water though, as now the framework for how to conduct the attack is unclear.

For now, the best answer I have is that counterstrikes should work against it, and you have to lose flying to use Trample, similar to a melee attack.  Besides that though, it shouldn't be treated as a melee attack. If anyone finds any other weird interactions where it not working like a melee attack causes problems, please let me know.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2017, 04:19:24 PM by Zuberi »

jacksmack

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 984
  • Banana Stickers 18
    • View Profile
Re: Titanodon
« Reply #33 on: August 04, 2017, 04:32:00 AM »
Its a terrible trait / ability / attack due to its complex interaction.

That's what i thought when it was introduced, and that hasn't changed.
I'm very much against introducing additional complex interacting cards as there is already PLENTY of things you need to memorize when it comes to how different cards and effects work together.

Halewijn

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 1775
  • Banana Stickers 6
    • View Profile
Re: Titanodon
« Reply #34 on: August 04, 2017, 06:57:13 AM »
The thing about complex traits (grapple, trample, aura's, rage,  ...) is that many of those don't show in a game unless you specifically take that card in the book. If you do, you should be able to inform the specifics to your opponent. I don't think you need to know every trait by hearth.

Although I agree that trample might be a little messy. Rules as intended should be clear though no? Zuberi cleared up the questions and I'm sure the rules supplement will get updated regarding this topic.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2017, 06:59:18 AM by Halewijn »
  • Favourite Mage: Bloodwave Warlord
When in doubt kill it with fire? I never doubt and crush them right away.