August 22, 2017, 09:31:43 PM

Author Topic: Rise of the Necromancer.  (Read 809 times)

drmambo23

  • Ambassador
  • Playtester
  • Sr. Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 414
  • Banana Stickers 1
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #15 on: June 30, 2017, 10:15:34 AM »
Oh, no doubt that trade off is better for the person playing the pillar. You get the attacks and make me react. But if i can spend 11 mana and 2 actions to save the hoard its worth it to me.  All that to say i dont feel the pillar is OP. As with any well timed card, its just a great tactic to swing the game in your favor for a turn or 2 allowing you to capitalize. If your opponent doesnt react well it could be the game
  • Favourite Mage: Darkfenne Necromancer
"Only the dead have seen the end of war"

RomeoXero

  • Sr. Mage
  • ****
  • Posts: 427
  • Banana Stickers 4
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #16 on: June 30, 2017, 10:34:59 AM »
The priest is not terrible. Ray play on Octgn and ill show you how not terrible he is ;)
  • Favourite Mage: Wychwood Druid
I love this game. Its awesome!

Enti

  • Full Mage
  • ***
  • Posts: 106
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2017, 11:37:15 AM »
But the pillar isnt a make or break for the necro.

The pillar is by far (by a large margin) the strongest card against necromancer - period.


Ive got my butt handed to me multiple times by holy mages that havent used the pillar.

I think necro vs. holy mage (without pillar) favors the necro. I'd even say favors the necro highly. Because you can force the holy mage to come to you. And that alone messes up their planned gamestyle in many cases.



 Yeah its a very good card but 1 force wave and a wall stops it.  2 cards i reccomend for any necro zombie. And if 2 actions and 11 mana keep all of your zombies from taking a ton of damage its worth it.
I wish it would be so easy. But even assuming that your strategy would render PoRF useless, you still have taken at least 12 dice of dmg, probably 18 dice and then you need to spend 2 actions and 11 mana to counter this single 9 mana card.

So you have invested more mana, more actions, and have already taken a lot of damage.

And that's best case. Sooo... in a close/balanced game this single cards tilts the advantage (significantly) to the holy mage.

drmambo23

  • Ambassador
  • Playtester
  • Sr. Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 414
  • Banana Stickers 1
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2017, 12:23:22 PM »
Like i said, it can be the game winning card. But i still dont see that 1 card as the bane of a necromancers existence. I know you have given the dice amounts, but from experience It has never made the game horrible for me or anything when im playing a necro.  Just work around it however you can, or let it eat up your hoard.  Lastly, so we are all in agreement on this, the card, for what it cost and what it can do, is superb!
  • Favourite Mage: Darkfenne Necromancer
"Only the dead have seen the end of war"

Mystery

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 1856
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2017, 01:29:30 PM »
Like i said, it can be the game winning card. But i still dont see that 1 card as the bane of a necromancers existence. I know you have given the dice amounts, but from experience It has never made the game horrible for me or anything when im playing a necro.  Just work around it however you can, or let it eat up your hoard.  Lastly, so we are all in agreement on this, the card, for what it cost and what it can do, is superb!

I would say so either, its not much worse against most other mages. The worst part about the pillar is just it is stupid in timed matches, just enlengthening the game. I am not playing timed matches but if I would I include it in every book (even dark)

Enti

  • Full Mage
  • ***
  • Posts: 106
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2017, 01:41:33 PM »
Well, against zombies who are bloodthirsty it definitely is stronger than against other mages. Because they can't just leave the zone (and get +2 dice 4 times in a row).

But yeah, even in regular matches this card is still good - that shows just how good  the card really is.

Puddnhead

  • Member of Arcane Duels; MageCast Co-host
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 1226
  • Banana Stickers 5
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #21 on: June 30, 2017, 01:47:58 PM »
While I somewhat agree with you guys, my reason for the rise of the Necromancer is Resilient.  Resilient means that more often than not your creatures will trade favorably with anyone else's creatures.  Sure you can get unlucky and they roll all crits, but Graveyard and the generally high health and low cost of zombies in general means that it doesn't actually sting you that much to lose a creature to a dice anomaly.

(As the to the derailment of Pillar of Righteous Flame, Resilient still works against it's attack and Cloak of Shadows is in school and something that most Necromancers have in their books anyway.)
  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster

Mystery

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 1856
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #22 on: June 30, 2017, 02:43:58 PM »
While I somewhat agree with you guys, my reason for the rise of the Necromancer is Resilient.  Resilient means that more often than not your creatures will trade favorably with anyone else's creatures.  Sure you can get unlucky and they roll all crits, but Graveyard and the generally high health and low cost of zombies in general means that it doesn't actually sting you that much to lose a creature to a dice anomaly.

(As the to the derailment of Pillar of Righteous Flame, Resilient still works against it's attack and Cloak of Shadows is in school and something that most Necromancers have in their books anyway.)

but it is in combination with poison immunity. cause on other mages you just ignore the creatures for example and curse them to death or such. And also skeleton necros are good. Poison immunity just frees quite some sbp for more creature support spells instead of opening the weakness while doing so

Puddnhead

  • Member of Arcane Duels; MageCast Co-host
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 1226
  • Banana Stickers 5
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #23 on: June 30, 2017, 02:57:31 PM »
While I somewhat agree with you guys, my reason for the rise of the Necromancer is Resilient.  Resilient means that more often than not your creatures will trade favorably with anyone else's creatures.  Sure you can get unlucky and they roll all crits, but Graveyard and the generally high health and low cost of zombies in general means that it doesn't actually sting you that much to lose a creature to a dice anomaly.

(As the to the derailment of Pillar of Righteous Flame, Resilient still works against it's attack and Cloak of Shadows is in school and something that most Necromancers have in their books anyway.)

but it is in combination with poison immunity. cause on other mages you just ignore the creatures for example and curse them to death or such. And also skeleton necros are good. Poison immunity just frees quite some sbp for more creature support spells instead of opening the weakness while doing so

Absolutely, Poison Immunity is great...but I find that it means more creatures not necessarily more creature support spells.  I don't see very many creature support spells in Necromancer books.  Which ones do you see?
  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster

Mystery

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 1856
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2017, 03:18:14 PM »
the just mentioned force wave, more marked for death/rusts/acid balls then for example the beast master as you can save a bit on your anti curse stuff. such stuff i mean, backuping the indirect buffs is easier sbp wise

drmambo23

  • Ambassador
  • Playtester
  • Sr. Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 414
  • Banana Stickers 1
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2017, 03:41:30 PM »
Marked for death, curse of decay, agony and chains of agony are top picks for me because they work in mirror matches. But chains of agony isnt one i use very much. I keep 1 rust, 1 to 2 chant of rage, and so on. I cant remember all the enchants i use. But puddin is right - every card i just mentioned is a card used for the enemy. The only cards i have to help my zombies are force wave, lesser teleport, gravikor, and zombie frenzy. If im feeling saucy i will add an extinguish just in case. But the fact is you dont need to support them because they are resilient, bloodthirsty, and are very generous in their mana cost. They are self relient creatures that dont need to be taken care of which is why i use them in tournaments. Just throw them out and let them do their thing.
  • Favourite Mage: Darkfenne Necromancer
"Only the dead have seen the end of war"

Reddicediaries

  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 912
  • Banana Stickers 1
  • Don't count me out!
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2017, 11:20:19 PM »
Since priestess is (by far!) the strongest holy mage she consequently is the toughest opponent for the necro.

I played dozens of times with necro against paladin and he not even once was able to get his auras activated.
Furthermore his ballista loses ~half its effectiveness because the piercing is completely useless against zombies and skeletons.
That actually leads to the fact that paladins tend to attack the graveyard, what ultimately seals their demise.

Priest, no comment, still the weakest holy mage.

Priestess...  brrrr.

Without Pillar of Righteous Flame there wouldn't be a problem in the first place. But this pillar is just sooo fucking OP against necro. I can only urge every mage to include a pillar. Because it evens out the odds against necromancer. (and apart from that it's still a strong card in other match-ups)

Of course, that's just my point of view.
The Ballista is not meant to be used against skellies and zombies. However, it still is free 5 dmg.
If they focus the graveyard smartly, I see no reason why that means they essentially just loose the game. I played the matchup a bunch of times with my paladin and I started winning most of them after learning the matchup.
Auras are the icing on the cake, not the bread and butter. That being said, all you need to do is use your ring to kill one or two level 2-3 creatures and you should have enough valor to activate most auras.
Priest is not weak. He's really strong in the right hands and is best used (not) being played like the priestess imo.
I also don't think the priestess is the strongest Holy mage. She and the Paladin are tied for me and Priest isn't very far behind.
If attacking the spawnpoint auto loses you the game, how does Shark ever win vs angel priestess? I don't get your logic. It all depends on the player.
Edit: (not)
« Last Edit: July 02, 2017, 11:26:45 AM by Reddicediaries »
  • Favourite Mage: Wychwood Druid
All sides ready? Remember no killing, maiming, soul sucking, or any other funny buisness. This is just a training match. Let the Battle Comence!

bigfatchef

  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 568
  • Banana Stickers 0
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #27 on: July 02, 2017, 05:11:50 AM »
The Ballista is not meant to be used against skellies and zombies. However, it still is free 5 dmg.
How do you know how the ballista is meant to be used? Is anything meant to shoot something with aegis then? Is ballistas purpose to shoot heavy armor conjurations only? I agree with your conclusion that it is still 5 dice. I still feel free to shoot whatever I want with it :)

Priest is not weak. He's really strong in the right hands and is best used now being played like the priestess imo.
I also don't think the priestess is the strongest Holy mage. She and the Paladin are tied for me and Priest isn't very far behind.
Must disagree here! If you play priest as priestess, but without priestess abilities and -1 channeling, how can you say they are even close? Priest is much worse especially if you play him as you are telling us!
Play priest with avenger and burns to use his skills and he gets better, but is still worse.
What you are actually saying is, that holy school is very strong, even when playing the weak mage wrong.

Sailor Vulcan

  • Secret Identity: Imaginator
  • Legendary Mage
  • *****
  • Posts: 2856
  • Banana Stickers 3
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #28 on: July 02, 2017, 09:01:00 AM »
If you're playing the priest, you usually want to include a spawnpoint or familiar. Otherwise he won't have enough actions or mana unless he is rushing with attack spells. The reason for this is because the priest tends to be more controlling than other aggressive mages but more aggressive than other controlling mages. The priest wants to be attacking a lot, but he has a bunch of other spells he wants to cast. It took me a really long time to realize this. Before I figured out how to play the priest, I was always short on mana and actions. I had thought the priest was too weak to compete with the other  mages. I'm much better with him now.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-J320A using Tapatalk

  • Favourite Mage: Salenia Forcemaster
I am Sailor Vulcan! Champion of justice and reason! And yes, I am already aware my uniform is considered flashy, unprofessional, and borderline sexually provocative for my species by most intelligent lifeforms. I did not choose this outfit. Shut up.

silverclawgrizzly

  • Charlotte Mage Warrior
  • Playtester
  • Legendary Mage
  • *
  • Posts: 2168
  • Banana Stickers 3
    • View Profile
Re: Rise of the Necromancer.
« Reply #29 on: July 02, 2017, 09:06:55 AM »
Ok take the priest debate to another thread please. This one is about the Necromancer.
  • Favourite Mage: Straywood Beastmaster
What we must all remember is no matter the game we were all newbies at one point.