August 17, 2019, 03:58:50 PM

Author Topic: Damage Barrier  (Read 15787 times)

Mathias

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Re: Damage Barrier
« Reply #15 on: December 09, 2012, 11:32:18 AM »
Quote from: "Drealin" post=4846
Reverse Attack says you become the controller of that attack.


I vote for Drealin. I also read clearly "You become the controller".
Since the wizard is attacking Warlock, wizard will get hit by DB.

However:
Some scenerios in my head (realistic feel):

1) Wizard would jump at Warlock (melee). As he comes close he gets hit by the damage barrier and suffer damage.

2) Warlock is going to hit Wizard. In my head I see a Warlock running with his lash at
the Wizard. As he pulls his lash the Wizard cast his spell to make the lash backfire in the Warlocks face.
In my view they don't get close to each other and DB would not trigger.

3) Warlock is going at Wizard with a staf, at which point would the wizard cast his spell?
From the moment the Warlock starts running at him? Too far away for DB
Just befor Impact? In range for DB
(I see DB as kind of aura near the body of the protected one)

No real conclusion possible, they all have a realistic feel.

Point of Logic.

Shad0w rules that the Warlock is still the source of the attack.
DB would only trigger when an enemy would melee attack.
If Warlock would still be the source of the attack, he attacks himself. Or friendly fire.
Enemy = non - friendly
Thus, Warlock is not an enemy, thus DB would not trigger.

Consequence:
All friendly creatures (non - enemy) who attack their friendly mage, would not suffer
DB if he has one, because they are not enemies.

Hedge

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Re: Damage Barrier
« Reply #16 on: December 09, 2012, 01:23:04 PM »
Mathias has the most compelling argument so far, and I agree with him. a damage barrier only works against enemy attacks the warlock is not an enemy to himself.



Hedge

Mathias

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Re: Damage Barrier
« Reply #17 on: December 09, 2012, 01:58:24 PM »
I've read the rules again in full.

Somewhere in the full rules you can read: may do a free attack.
So it is optional.

In the side bar the word "can" do a free attack.

Both "may" and "can" are not the same as "must" and the mage has a choise to
use his DB. In this case the Warlock wil not trigger the DB likewise :)

Shad0w

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Re: Damage Barrier
« Reply #18 on: December 09, 2012, 04:48:03 PM »
Quote from: "Mathias" post=5133

Point of Logic.

Shad0w rules that the Warlock is still the source of the attack.
DB would only trigger when an enemy would melee attack.
If Warlock would still be the source of the attack, he attacks himself. Or friendly fire.
Enemy = non - friendly
Thus, Warlock is not an enemy, thus DB would not trigger.

Consequence:
All friendly creatures (non - enemy) who attack their friendly mage, would not suffer
DB if he has one, because they are not enemies.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you look at what I post I never state that it must be an enemy attack and I also state that the attack is automatic.  When you look in to rule in the codex it does state enemy but when you look at the full rules section it does not. I also did not use may in my post. Because when the updated rules are posted the plan was to change this (I have not heard word when we will get the update rules out. Kind of busy finishing the FM vs the Warlord set ). I was basing my ruling off the newer cleaner wording that should be in place. If you need to look at what I posted it is in the spoiler below.

[spoiler]
Here is the rules for Damage Barrier

Damage Barriers
A damage barrier is a special kind of protection that gives a defender a “free” attack against every attacker that makes a successful melee attack against it. This attack occurs automatically during the damage Barrier Step of the attack. The defender may not use a damage barrier unless
the melee attack was “successful”. If all of the attacks were avoided by Defenses, or “missed”
because of being Dazed, then the damage barrier cannot be used. However, if at least one melee
attack rolled dice during the Roll Dice Step, then the damage barrier may be used. A damage barrier can attack each attacker once each round. If an attacker gets multiple strikes, the damage barrier only gets to attack once after all the attacks are complete.

Note: A damage barrier works only against melee
attacks. A creature that is the target of a ranged attack or other non-melee attack does not get to use its damage barrier. Damage barrier attacks always have the Unavoidable trait, and cannot be avoided by a Defense.


Because this attack from the barrier is automatic the Warlock can not choose to turn it off and therefore gets hit by it.[/spoiler]
"Darth come prove to meet you are worthy of the fighting for your school in the arena and not just another scholar to be discarded like an worn out rag doll"


Quote: Shad0w the Arcmage

Mathias

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Re: Damage Barrier
« Reply #19 on: December 09, 2012, 05:04:24 PM »
Thx Shad0w,

Do note this rule (in spoiler) still sounds conflicting:

1) A DB is an automatic attack
2) "if at least one melee attack rolled dice during the Roll Dice Step, then the damage barrier may be used"

If the attack is mandatory, "may" has to be preplaced with "must".
May does gives one a choice, which it has not according to the rules.

the_iron_troll

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Re: Damage Barrier
« Reply #20 on: December 09, 2012, 08:11:24 PM »
Oooh, nice catch Mathias.

Arcanus? Does the "may" in this situation stop the "automatic" attack?

Shad0w

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Re: Damage Barrier
« Reply #21 on: December 10, 2012, 12:58:42 AM »
Another instance of conflicting text. Thanks for pointing this out. Even after several rereads I missed it.


"This attack occurs automatically during the damage Barrier Step of the attack. "

"However, if at least one melee attack rolled dice during the Roll Dice Step, then the damage barrier may be used. "

That was the most current wording I had at the time I post. I think I had read this 3-4 times and never noticed those conflicting lines. That is what I get for looking over too many keyword rules this past week.  think at that point I will leave this for Bryan to rule on.
"Darth come prove to meet you are worthy of the fighting for your school in the arena and not just another scholar to be discarded like an worn out rag doll"


Quote: Shad0w the Arcmage