August 17, 2019, 04:00:48 PM

Author Topic: How long do you have to develop at the start?  (Read 5506 times)

RARodger

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How long do you have to develop at the start?
« on: March 17, 2013, 06:20:28 PM »
After yet another defeat I thought I'd try a Warlock Equip build with some creature support. My idea includes spending the first few turns unpacking equipment and Harmonizing stuff. I did up a little spread sheet to try to make sure that I could do what I wanted to do in a reasonable amount of time...

By the fourth turn I'd have a Battle Forge, Mana Crystal and Moonglow Amulet each harmonized for +1 channelling, the Demon Hide Armor, the Lash of Hellfire and either a Darkfenne Bat or Firebrand Imp.

In the fifth turn I'd still have enough for a decent sized creature or a Pentagram if my opponent isn't pushing the attack, or a couple attack spells or curses if he is.

I know the answer is really "it depends" because opponents varry, but in general would you think this would be moving too slowly?

Tacullu64

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2013, 06:38:19 PM »
Welcome to the forums.

It would be a rare game where that is not moving too slow. Most strategies don't require that much channeling. Most Warlock builds are starting to pressure the opposing mage by turn 3.

The Warlock build that won the first official tournament is posted in the Spellbook Design and Construction section. The thread is Lord of Terror. It's not the only approach to playing a Warlock but it is a good read and should give you some ideas. I posted the link below.

http://magewars.com/jsite/forum/spellbook-design-and-construction/7591-lord-of-terror-bashcon-beatdown-build

baronzaltor

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2013, 08:37:16 PM »
Quote from: "RARodger" post=9257

By the fourth turn I'd have a Battle Forge, Mana Crystal and Moonglow Amulet each harmonized for +1 channelling


Mana Crystals and Moonglow Amulents cannot be Harmonized.

Harmonize requires the target to have the actual Channeling Stat, (such as a mage, spawnpoint or familar) and increases it by 1.

Mana Crystals/Flowers and Moonglow Amulet give +1 Channeling, but do not have a Channeling stat themselves.

Hey_Daralon

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2013, 09:14:46 PM »
I'd say the opening setup that you just mentioned isn't too bad, you should be ready to start throwing down by turn 3 or 4, depending on how aggressive you want your mage to be. I'd try to get the Battleforge out first, then the Pentagram next turn, also while summoning a Mana Crystal/Moonglow Amulet. If you're up against a very aggressive opponent and need to buy a little time, try getting a Wall of Fire or two up, then send just send something with Fire Immunity right through it when you're ready.
Moreover as it was mentioned earlier, you don't have to cast Harmonize on stuff except for Battleforge/Pentagram. Harmonize doesn't increase the Mage's channeling unless it's specifically attached to the mage.

DarthDadaD20

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #4 on: March 18, 2013, 09:20:41 AM »
I would say around past turn 3 if you are still building up an economy, you would need a good reason.
That said the warlock gets real ugly at turn three, in my last game I got 27 points to the dome in turn 3.
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Preacher

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #5 on: March 18, 2013, 09:56:48 AM »
Personally I'd say yes, that is too slow, I like things like fast set-ups and action advantage myself though. Mage Wars is (in my opinion) at least 50% about tactics and if you are still planning to build up on turn 4-5 in most games.... you are setting up for failure vs quick kill decks.

Tacullu64

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2013, 10:15:27 AM »
Quote from: "Preacher" post=9305
Personally I'd say yes, that is too slow, I like things like fast set-ups and action advantage myself though. Mage Wars is (in my opinion) at least 50% about tactics and if you are still planning to build up on turn 4-5 in most games.... you are setting up for failure vs quick kill decks.


It doesn't matter if you are planning an offensive onslaught or a defensive stand you've got to start executing your plan by turn 3 at the latest, even in the least competitive environment. In a casual game build ups can last longer.

To sum it up I agree with you. I just wanted to work in that you need to get defense in place as quick as possible too, and casual play frequently breaks the set up time standards.

Sausageman

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2013, 08:32:07 AM »
I find it best to try to play different books/opponents too, to try out strategies like this.  Against a Priestess Temple book, a setup like this would be fine, against a Warlock that Teleports in a Fireballs you turn 1, how do you deal with that?  :)  It forces you to adapt your strategy.

My first half dozen games or so AT LEAST, I wasn't concerned with winning, and more learning and trying out different strategies.  I reckon this has paid off.
Though I still blow, to be fair.  :)

Jon.Ambriz

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #8 on: May 28, 2013, 05:50:24 PM »
Well, I have tried out several strategies, and my personal favorite openings depend on the type of Mage I am playing. If I play a Wizard, I typically start by playing equipment that increases my Channeling and start from their. A Warlock I start by dropping a war forge and then spend a few turns stacking equipment while dropping Hellions and Gorgon Archers.

Though, as Sausageman said, I typically adapt my strategies based on how my opponent is playing, since seeing the what I call "hyper aggression" of an early game Teleport into Fireball/blast is very annoying, that does place my opponent in a perfect position to get hammered by creatures or my own spells.
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That's a nice spell you have there. It'd be a shame if something happened to it.

Shad0w

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2013, 07:24:05 AM »
Like the Bash build take a look at this http://forum.arcanewonders.com/index.php?topic=10899.new#new I have already setup for the kill by turn 4. This is not a fun build if you are playing with friends and teaching DO NOT PLAY this build.

If you lets us know how you are playing we can help make a build to fit that play style. Competitive, Semi Competitive, or for fun?
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Jon.Ambriz

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2013, 02:52:51 PM »
Well now, I usually play MW like I play League of Legends. I take my time to set up in the early game, and play cautious during mid-game, and finish off by the late game. Though, this does not mean I won't play competitively, I just play for fun more often than not. I still haven't had the time to really customize my Forcemaster beyond the starter book, which I think is more than enough to decimate custom books with some minor tweaking here or there for personal flavor spells.

Though, I'm still archaically teaching MW with the Rulebook V1.0, so I do have a few things to update on.
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That's a nice spell you have there. It'd be a shame if something happened to it.

cbalian

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2013, 09:24:20 AM »
I'm a big fan of having more channeling then my opponent.  It's a bit slower but over time you beat them down because you can summon/cast more than them.  This of course works best in the Wizard deck with mana suppression techniques and I also like to toss the Upkeep +2 on any creatures they toss at me early (especially weak ones that I don't need to worry about killing).  Then those creatures are more of a detriment to their end game.  Since so many folks like to rush you I actually like it when they summon little guys and send them out, and make them pay for it every turn.

I usually do something like this:
Turn 1:  Moonglow amulet + Mana Crystal (get the juices flowing early) +2 every round adds up
Turn 2:  Spawnpoint + Harmonize
Turn 3:  Familiar + Harmonize
After that it is creatures because by now they are sending attacks at you.

This also favors my usual strategy with is to let them come to me (and I am a HUGE fan of ranged attacks)  Gorgon + Basilisk are deadly together.

nitrodavid

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2013, 06:35:53 PM »
I played my first comp game of mage wars yesterday. I was air wizard running mana denial. I found that in both games the other mage was force pushing me into a square with grizzly by then 3. I can't think of any slow build deck that would compete against a rush deck. so even though I hate rush books I have no option but to run one. because there is really no option to stop a rush when you consider you are already behind significant mana (each channel item costs around 5 mana so takes 5 turns to pay off). mage wars is suppose to be a game if counters, while I can't find a counter to rush it is like playing rock paper sizzors with no paper.
Being Aussie we place all our cards face down, apart from enchantments which are face up

sIKE

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2013, 06:41:52 PM »
Bring them all the way down to your start corner then teleport to the other corner, buys you three rounds, some times :)

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nitrodavid

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Re: How long do you have to develop at the start?
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2013, 06:49:25 PM »
teleport has range of 0-2 so you spend 1 action to move 1 creature 2 spaces away. assuming they want to be in your face the creature will just double move back to you, so you have spent 6 mana and gained nothing (1 turn delay cost you 1 turn action).

Being Aussie we place all our cards face down, apart from enchantments which are face up