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Messages - gw

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151
Thanks for your input again. Re-reading my last post I think I sounded a bit rude here and there, which wasn't my intention - sry for that.  :)

@ Sleep cost

I only re-added the 1 mana you substracted because I think the substraction is not justified.
Yes, there is 1 mana on the VTree, which makes the Lotus "cheaper". Phrased in another way: It is a mana
which you do not have to pay from your mage's mana pool.
BUT I think that the distinction between spawnpoint mana and mage mana does not justify a substraction because if I hadn't cast a spawnpoint, I would have cast a mana flower/crystal earlier (the 1 mana on the VTree would be in my pool then). A spawn point is nothing else than a flower/crystal with the price of restricted mana usage for an extra ability (like an action).
I have to admit though that there is my underlying assumption that if you do not cast a spawnpoint you cast a crystal/flower at that time - otherwise you are totally right.

Your examples of Sleep + Teleport / Quicksand and comparison to the target creature cost are quite convincing, I have to say. Especially the Sleep+Quicksand combo is shockingly evil  :o
I am still not sure about the cost of Lotus vs. Sleep ... I admit that I like it cheap and I feel that ~3 mana is a significant difference. I will re-add the Lotus though - just to have the possibility to test them more.

@Harmonize with Shift intention

I see your point.
At the moment, changing this would have a concrete effect though :

Shift intention :
1. Fellella + Harmo
2. VTree + Harmo (Fellella) + Mage movement

Direct onto Mage :
1. VTree + Harmo
2. Fellella + Harmo (hidden!) onto Mage
-> no movement left as Fellella's action is missing, Harmo#2 not active

I like the option of going a bit aggro early for which I want to have the mage's movement. So for the moment I'd like to keep it this way.

EDIT : OHH WAIT ... I could do the following :
1. VTree + Mana Flower + Move
2. Fellella + Harmo on Vtree
That's actually an improvement.

@ few vines
Yes, I am amused by that too.
I have not been in a situation though where I missed a vine / had nothing to do for my VTree.
4 Raptors and 3 Tanglevine alone cover 7 actions which are almost guaranteed to be used.
I do have the intention of re-adding Kralathor, which would be +1 :)
I'd also like to add a LoS-blocking wall to prevent a WizTower from fireballing my VTree but the vine wall sadly doesn't have LoS.

152
There's more to it than bypassing guards. It's only one thing it can do, as you should know from my previous post. ACG and I have mentioned several uses of Snatch already, so reducing all of that to just the guard aspect is absurd.
I didn't reduce it, I refered to the other options as "tricky play which simply does not fit my playstyle" and is a whole different deck concept. The only suggestion which looked interesting to me for my deck was the guard aspect.

I get that you want to make Fellella a major focus in your book, but unfortunately she isn't a very powerful card.
I disagree.

I explained this already in previous post.
No, you didn't. Your explanation didn't make any sense in that context, it was merely a rulebook definiton of acid. Also, it wasn't you who wrote in the first place.

Sleep:
4: 8
5: 10
6: 12
7: 14 (one creature currently)

Deployed Lotus:
4: 6 (Vine Tree has at least 1 mana on it) + 6 = 12
5: 6 + 7 = 13
6: 6 + 8 = 14
7: 6 + 9 = 15

Not sure why you put a discount on the Lotus calculation as VineTree channeling for other mages would simply be replaced by ManaCrystal income or whatever, as the VineTree is only a class-specific way of building up a mana income - which every class does.
On level 4-5 you then have a difference of 8 to 13 (=5) and 10 to 14 (=4) - not 2-3 as you mentioned. Also, I do not really care about their 3 attack dice because the purpose I have them in my deck for is not as a damage dealer but as a reliable Sleep-caster. I also think that -ignoring the difference in costs- the Sleep condition is not worth the sheer amount of 13+ mana.


---

Had a nice session with my friends yesterday and had plenty of opportunity to playtest things. Some impressions on stuff I was concerned with or how things worked out :

Modified my starting strategy a bit to have the possibility to be more aggro, which went quite well and let to some early resigns:
1. Fellella + Harmo
2. Vinetree + Harmo (by F.) and now not ShiftingEnchantment but using the FullAction to move to NC.
from then on just spread vines to my opponent, equipped my mage and kept casting Raptors via the Vines, while my mage participated in battle. I think one game was over after 10 minutes.

Actually, as Aylin pointed out, having a harmonized Fellella puts a lot of pressure on you to not "miss a beat".
I now also think it is better to ShiftEnchantment Fellella's Harmonize on my mage and keep the other Harmo on the VTree (did it vice versa before). This action is a nice low cost (=1 mana) way to save some mana for the next round which can easily be done when in doubt if you have anything meaningful to do. (or lack the mana :) )

One nice experience was one game against a FM using Thoughtspore + Invis Stalker which my Tarok and Falcons handled easily. I more and more come to think that "Flying" is the best trait around atm.

Apart from a standard game vs. GateToVoltari Wizard, the rematch with some modification to the Wizard deck developed into an epic 3 hour to the hilt clash of Titans which was tons of fun :)
The game had several interesting phases and plays but one phase was of special interest. The Wizard managed to get out a Teleport-Wand (previously, for 2-3 rounds a HealingWand) which I just couldn't get rid of. Range for Dissolve or Mana+Timing for Orchid - there always was something that didn't work out. Still, I had enough pressure on the board that this actually didn't matter that much. Lesson learned : If a wand hits the table, no need to panic.

Letting a harmonized VTree gather 4-6 mana (=2-3 turns) and then having him cast a Raptor feels like a nice rhythm when playing (situational deviations ofc).

Fellella + Decoy = Imba  8) (just kidding, but Decoy kicks a** and Fellella is the one who makes it worth playing.)

Wanted to test IronGolem but casted him in 0 of the games. So he is out again.

Some thoughts on "Defense"
Person 1 : "My mage always fails the defensive rolls. That sucks. It feel I roll better when creatures defend."
Person 2 : "Defense is not a relevant concept for a mage. A defense roll is there to psychologically scare your opponent away from attacking. A creature with a defense roll is less often attacked because it might mean a waste of action. Being attacked less often = defense works.
This does not apply to the mage as he must be attacked - attacking the mage is the purpose of game. You can't scare someone away from attacking him.""

New Deck :
Druid

---  Attack  ---
2 Force Hammer
2 Acid Ball
1 Surging Wave

---  Conjuration  ---
1 Vine Tree
3 Tanglevine
1 Corrosive Orchid
1 Enchanter's Wardstone

---  Creature  ---
1 Fellella, Pixie Familiar
4 Raptor Vine
1 Tarok, the Skyhunter
2 Thunderift Falcon
1 Guardian Angel

---  Enchantment  ---
2 Harmonize
2 Rhino Hide
1 Block
2 Nullify
1 Teleport Trap
1 Healing Charm
4 Bear Strength
1 Mongoose Agility
4 Decoy
1 Falcon Precision
1 Barkskin
2 Bull Endurance

---  Equipment  ---
1 Elemental Cloak
1 Mage Staff
1 Mage Wand
1 Veterans Belt
1 Dragonscale Hauberk
1 Wand of Healing

---  Incantation  ---
4 Dispel
4 Dissolve
3 Rouse the Beast
1 Shift Enchantment
2 Teleport
2 Burst of Thorns
1 Seeking Dispel



153
I will see the deck in RL action today again so this will probably lead to some new impressions and some changes.
Let me address only a few points please and even if I argue against them I do appreciate your input as it makes me think about stuff  8)

Thornlashers are good.
I can imagine some nice situations / tricky plays with Thornsnappers but I just don't set them up/play for them. Maybe that's simply a playstyle thing.
If I want to get rid of an opponent's guard I can simply Tanglevine the guard or become elusive or ... - I do see the counterargument that Thornlashers are a permanent but at the moment for me the "good at removing/snatching guards" is not enough.

Purpose of Spawnpoints is the action advantage. Saving mana is a waste.
Yes, still (reasonable) actions are limited by mana, so it might not be possible to use them every turn.
Let's assume : QC Mage, Action Mage, Fellella, Reveal Ench, Vine Tree are 5 actions/ turn - or 4+Fellella.
I do not think there is a current spellbook that generates an amount of mana needed to pay for all these actions every turn(?).
Quote
Since you'd be using Fellela as well, you could deploy a Raptor Vine, enchant it with Bear Strength, Rouse it, and still do something else all in a single round, as an example.
Yes, turns like this happen but they are not affordable every round.

Quote
You have no worthwhile ways to buff a swarm aside from acid,
I am irritated by the word "buff" as I understand it as "putting a (permanent) positive effect on sth" ... so in my vocabulary "acid" isn't a buff. Also, I don't see how acid helps defending against a swarm (=lots of creatures). Problem is that I don't understand why I would like to buff my opponents swarm and what that has to do with acid.
I simply do not understand what is meant  :) :)

My thoughts about Nightshade Lotus :
a Sleep that can be cast by my spawnpoint wherever I have a vine => total cost: casting cost (7) + effect (level +2) = 9 + Level = more expensive than a sleep incantation, eg: for level 1 : 10 vs 4





154
Thx for all the feedback.

@ sdougla2:

By my count, you only have 8 cards that Vine Tree can cast. For a mage that can excel at attrition like the Druid, I would generally want more things for my Spawnpoint to cast. You also don't have many creatures for a creature Spawnpoint build (particularly ones you can cast from that Spawnpoint).
As mana is limited I like to let the VTree collect some mana for 3-4 turns, so I don't need many vines. Also, imho there aren't that many good vines atm.

Why no Thornlashers? It seems like they would work well with your Iron Golem and provide you with some more position control.You have no worthwhile ways to buff a swarm aside from acid [hmm?], making Thunderdrift Falcons seem like an odd choice.
I don't think Thornlashers are good. You can maybe set up a nice highway or sth. which is probably fun but apart from that I don't really like them. Thunderift Falcons are in because : cheap and flying.

What are you planning on doing with Vampiric Strike?
Actually a very good point. I included it as a heal for my mage with the idea of using it on my creatues if need should be. It slipped my attention that only few creatues actually can use it. Interestingly, taking out Vampirism and replacing it by Vamp Strike was one of the last things I did simply because it is the cheaper card.

Why do you cast Harmonize on Fellella? She's already expensive and extremely vulnerable to Unavoidable attacks. The primary benefit of Fellella is the action advantage, not the mana. I think you would be better off playing a Druid's Leaf Ring or Mana Flower on turn 1 instead of Harmonize. Harmonize on Vine Tree makes a lot more sense. This leaves you less vulnerable to a single spell ruining your day. Why no Enchanter's Ring as a backup in case Fellella gets fried?Also, if you are going to use Fellella, consider running curses.
I did but they soak too many spell book points. I was running 2 GhoulRots but somehow they left the deck over time because I needed points. Might be temporary though.

Why run Deflection Bracers over Cobra Reflexes in a Fellella build, particularly when Cobra Reflexes is 2 spellpoints and Deflection Bracers is 3?
I did but CobraReflexes feels so expensive. Bracers 6 mana , Cobra 9 mana. I mean on paper it's only 3 mana but it feels different. As I have access to 4 actions (if needed) I like to keep it cheap - revealing Fellella's enchantments costs mana too  >:(

That creature could be Galador, Steelclaw Grizzly, Cervere, or Kralathor [..]
For some reason I don't like Kralathor. I replaced Galador with the Iron Golem more or less a moment before I posted. I usually don't cast more than 2 expensive creatures due to mana restrains and Tarok is more or less a given as he is flying; I simply think that there are better high-cost creatures than Galador - eg Iron Golem.

@Aylin
I would never Harmonize Fellella. The most mana she can contribute to any spell is 2, so if she's Harmonized and then doesn't cast an enchantment one turn for some reason, she's got mana sitting on her that can't ever be used (unless you Shift it away, but...)
This is where Decoy comes in handy. It really gives you a nice flexibility and mana infusion...you can for example cast Tarok and Iron Golem turn 3 (both 13 mana) by using Fellella's mana.

Why don't you cast the Vine Tree in the first round? It's cheaper than the familiar, and it increases your channeling at the same time. I'd recommend that you switch them (Harmonizing the tree here if you like).
As I can tap Fellella's mana by using Decoy I simply prefer having her out. I can use her mana (via Decoy) to cast anything - the VTree's casting is restricted.

With your current creatures I'd suggest Power Strike over Vampiric Strike. It's Novice as well, so 2x would only cost you 2 points. Though I am curious why you chose the Iron Golem in particular.
Yea, maybe a good idea as I overlooked sth with VampStrike anyway (see above).
I was looking for a replacement for Galador, meaning a high cost creature, and just want to test him. High armor might help against swarmy decks and psych immu and unmoveable might help with current meta-game issues (FM  8) ) - and the artwork is cool. Also, costing 13 mana fits in nicely. I am open for suggestions for a replacement though.


It is interesting that you use the Nightshade Lotus. I find its Sleep to be too expensive.

155
After some input by Aylin ( http://forum.arcanewonders.com/index.php?topic=13334.45 ) and some games my Druid deck has developed a bit. Comments are appreciated :)

What I like and think works well in the deck :
Fellella.

What I am unsure about:
The creatures. Not sure if there are enough. We do not have a creature heavy environment atm, so usually not more than 2-4 creatures are summoned on each side.

Usual start:
1. Fellella + Harmonize
2. Vine tree and go from there - if starting slowly : Harmonize on Tree (Fellella) + Shift Ench (Tree Harmo to Mage)
=> channel +11 and +2 Fellella and +1 Tree

Druid

---  Attack  ---
1 Force Hammer
2 Acid Ball
2 Surging Wave

---  Conjuration  ---
1 Vine Tree
2 Corrosive Orchid
2 Tanglevine

---  Creature  ---
1 Fellella, Pixie Familiar
4 Raptor Vine
1 Tarok, the Skyhunter
2 Thunderift Falcon
1 Iron Golem

---  Enchantment  ---
2 Harmonize
2 Rhino Hide
1 Block
3 Nullify
1 Teleport Trap
1 Healing Charm
3 Bear Strength
1 Mongoose Agility
4 Decoy
1 Falcon Precision
1 Barkskin

---  Equipment  ---
1 Elemental Cloak
1 Mage Staff
1 Mage Wand
1 Veterans Belt
1 Dragonscale Hauberk
1 Wand of Healing
1 Deflection Bracers

---  Incantation  ---
4 Dispel
4 Dissolve
2 Rouse the Beast
1 Shift Enchantment
2 Teleport
3 Burst of Thorns
2 Vampiric Strike

156
Hi  :)

Is the league sitll running or is there any kind of "organized and scheduled" play going on ?
Would like to play on a regular basis.

157
I like the streams. Keep doing them plz  :)

158
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Let's talk about the Druid!
« on: January 05, 2014, 05:08:16 AM »
Thanks for the input. Have also commented on some of your points and will definetely do some adjustments - and maybe play a game today if I meet someone online.

First, Seedling Pods while being terrible in general, are ATROCIOUS when used to summon a Mana Flower.
With the Leaf Ring, casting a Mana Flower pays for itself four turns later.
Casting a Seedling Pod with the Leaf Ring, which then casts a Mana Flower pays for itself seven turns later.
It doesn't save you any mana at all, it just delays the payoff for three turns.
True, I think I have to agree  8) .

Second, you build up way too much in your opening. The fact that you're having to use Decoy to transfer mana from your familiar to your mage is a bad sign.
I like that tbh. It costs a card but it makes Fellella's 2 mana available for any spell. It's not something that is very efficient but I don't plan to do it every turn.

Also how do you expect to be able to pay for revealing enchantments, deploying equipment, AND deploying vines in addition to at least your Quickcast? Going into turn 4 you have 10 mana to work with (13 including mana on spawnpoints). You're in a really bad spotif your opponent plans on coming for you in the early game, which is a pretty common strategy due to how effective it is.
As a side note to that, if you're having to use Meditation Amulet just to make the Battleforge viable, then it's time to just save yourself 8 build points by dropping both.
Without the Amulet you have 9 pieces of equipment, 3 of them are rings (though tbh I've found the Branch lackluster compared to Leaf and Enchanter's, Healing Wand works almost as well and the second hand slot isn't as valuable for the Druid as the ring slot is), one is a melee weapon (why?), and pretty much everything else is situational defensive items (except for the Mage Wand). If most of your equipment is situational then you don't really need a battleforge.
I see. I was afraid you would say so. When building I really wanted to have the Forge in to see how it is running. I did a solo game yesterday and also recognized that actually I don't really need it.
Having the Healing Wand as an alternative to the Branch didn't occur to me :)
I think the Mage Staff is a nice weapon ? It has Reach and Ethereal.


Third, you don't have enough Dissolves or Dispels. There is absolutely no excuse to take less than 4 Dissolves as a Druid. I'd switch out the Seeking Dispel for another Dispel and find some way of fitting in at least one more.
Will be done.

Fourth, Vine Snappers are terrible. The attack is great, but not being able to move is horrendous. With only one Thornlasher and one Teleport, you don't have the board control required to make them work. All your opponent would have to do is move one zone to the side. Raptor Vines are much better. A little more expensive, and the attack isn't as damaging against most targets (lacking the +1 pierce). On the other hand, the ability to move for 1 mana and Vampiric give it better positioning and staying power.
Ok, I agree. I thought Vine Snappers were nice to maybe be cast via vines into the same zone as an opponent's spawning point ? Just to annoy him a bit. Also, it might be a good defensive creature ?

Fifth, Tataree is not worth it. I've tried many times to run the butterfly, but the fact that only has a maximum of 9 life (with Etherian Lifetree and Bull Endurance) means it's too easy to kill with any unavoidable attack (especially zone attacks), or any sort of AoE dot (like Idol of Pestilence which your Necromancer opponent will probably use).
He got wall bashed pretty quickly in our previous games, yes - but ... but ... cute little butterfly !

Sixth, consider Tarok. You don't have any flying creatures at the moment and the bird work well against an early Lord of Fire. Also, no Kralathor? It's great against swarms, especially undead ones.
Ok, I had both in. I believe they were the last 2 cards I threw out due to not having enough points. As I'll discard the Battleforge they will be in again.

159
Strategy and Tactics / Re: Let's talk about the Druid!
« on: January 04, 2014, 04:59:19 PM »
Hello from Germany =) ,

I am new to Mage Wars and (obviously) to the forum but I really like that game and I got really hooked on it.
I also fell in love with the Druid so I am working a bit on her. There is little opportunity to playtest stuff - we do have our group playing it atm, but obviously we can't meet every day - and we are noobs :) . Anyway, I have a deck which I would like to have some feedback on. I love Fellella and I love the start - I am just totally unsure how to proceed etc.
Below I have given you an optimal 3 turn start (which already might be a bit too optimistic but it shows the general idea) but I feel it might work. What I am unsure about is : a) I probably do not have enough creatures (I do plan to let my Druid fight though) and b) I am sure there are cards in it that don't make sense or are underrepresented. Ok, feel free to comment on it.

Druid

---  Attack  ---
1 Force Hammer
3 Acid Ball

---  Conjuration  ---
1 Vine Tree
1 Battle Forge
1 Etherian Lifetree
2 Seedling Pod
2 Corrosive Orchid
1 Mana Flower
2 Nightshade Lotus
3 Tanglevine

---  Creature  ---
1 Galador, Protector of Straywood
2 Vine Snapper
1 Thornlasher
1 Fellella, Pixie Familiar
1 Tataree
1 Raptor Vine

---  Enchantment  ---
2 Harmonize
2 Rhino Hide
1 Cobra Reflexes
1 Jinx
1 Block
1 Nullify
1 Teleport Trap
1 Healing Charm
2 Bear Strength
1 Mongoose Agility
1 Ghoul Rot
1 Vampirism
2 Decoy
1 Falcon Precision
1 Barkskin

---  Equipment  ---
1 Eagleclaw Boots
1 Elemental Cloak
1 Mage Staff
1 Mage Wand
1 Druid's Leaf Ring
1 Mohktari's Branch
1 Veterans Belt
1 Meditation Amulet
1 Enchanter's Ring
1 Dragonscale Hauberk

---  Incantation  ---
1 Dispel
1 Seeking Dispel
1 Dissolve
2 Rouse the Beast
1 Shift Enchantment
1 Teleport
3 Burst of Thorns


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