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Author Topic: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning  (Read 10060 times)

piousflea

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Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« on: September 19, 2012, 08:48:34 PM »
So the "Hawkeye" enchantment gives Ranged +1 (Adds 1 attack dice to ranged attacks, has no effect on zone attacks). It seems pretty straightforward that this should improve Fireball and Lightning Bolt, as they are ranged attacks.

What about Chain Lightning? Unlike other area-effect spells it isn't a zone attack, it is a single target attack against a series of targets. Does Hawkeye buff the damage of CL from 5 dice to 6 dice?

If so, does this mean that the 2nd target recieves 5 dice of damage, instead of 4? That is, instead of rolling a theoretical maximum of 5+4+3+2+1 dice, CL could roll up to 6+5+4+3+2+1 dice?

Or does CL do 6+4+3+2+1 damage?

Shad0w

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2012, 10:20:38 AM »
Quote from: "piousflea" post=1256
So the "Hawkeye" enchantment gives Ranged +1 (Adds 1 attack dice to ranged attacks, has no effect on zone attacks). It seems pretty straightforward that this should improve Fireball and Lightning Bolt, as they are ranged attacks.

What about Chain Lightning? Unlike other area-effect spells it isn't a zone attack, it is a single target attack against a series of targets. Does Hawkeye buff the damage of CL from 5 dice to 6 dice?

If so, does this mean that the 2nd target recieves 5 dice of damage, instead of 4? That is, instead of rolling a theoretical maximum of 5+4+3+2+1 dice, CL could roll up to 6+5+4+3+2+1 dice?

Or does CL do 6+4+3+2+1 damage?


[strike]Chain Lightning is not a zone attack.Each attack is a separate ranged attack against a new target so each roll will get the bonus.  [/strike]

Also do not forgot
Important: No matter how many traits or effects apply, the
attacker always gets to roll at least 1 die, unless the target
is Immune to the damage type of the attack.

[strike]CL could roll up to 6+5+4+3+2+1+1+1+1... dice[/strike]. The only factors that rely limit this is the number of targets and if you roll damage or not. Also remember if you try to hit a target with defense and it passes the dodge the attack is canceled.

This happened to one of my players in the semifinals at Gencon his first target had a 6+ defense that the owner made the roll so the attack ended. I was the table judge at the time after the roll he was like I should have tried for something else first? I just looked and said yup. He lost that round.
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SeanDeCoy

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2012, 04:31:19 PM »
Hey guys,

I'm sorry - I have a correction here. This is actually a typo from the rulebook for the Ranged +X trait, and I'll be adding it as a correction on the site and in the forums.

Ranged +X should say: This creature gains + X attack dice when it makes a ranged attack. Has no effect on zone attacks. Does not grant a ranged attack if this creature does not have one. If the attack makes multiple attacks against the same or different objects, it gains this bonus only for the first attack it makes.
 
This is how all similar traits work, including Bloodthirsty +X, Mana Drain +X, Mana Transfer +X, Melee +X, etc.
 
It still has no effect on zone attacks.

Thanks, and sorry for the confusion!

Shad0w

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2012, 07:30:28 AM »
Thanks Sean for the heads up on the typo .

Based off this it would look like 6,4,3,2,1,1,1...
6 dice for CL + hawkeye, 4 for no hawkeye and -1from CL. Chain Lightning is not a zone attack. Each attack is a separate ranged attack against a new target so each roll will not get the bonus.

Also do not forgot
Important: No matter how many traits or effects apply, the
attacker always gets to roll at least 1 die, unless the target
is Immune to the damage type of the attack.
This would be the correct ruling based off the new text.
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Klaxas

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2012, 01:19:56 PM »
does that mean with chain lightning you can keep rolling 1 die untill you fail to damage something, regardless of the number of targets?
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Shad0w

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2012, 03:52:10 PM »
The card itself states you can not target the same object more than once.
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Klaxas

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2012, 04:23:57 AM »
that isnt what i was asking.  since the minimim dice to roll is 1, can you keep rolling 1 die 1 die 1 die, untill you run out of targets or fail to damage one?
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Shad0w

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #7 on: September 24, 2012, 11:32:01 AM »
Quote from: "Klaxas" post=1317
that isnt what i was asking.  since the minimim dice to roll is 1, can you keep rolling 1 die 1 die 1 die, untill you run out of targets or fail to damage one?


Correct
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Mestrahd

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2012, 11:05:28 AM »
Quote from: "SeanDeCoy" post=1292
Hey guys,

I'm sorry - I have a correction here. This is actually a typo from the rulebook for the Ranged +X trait, and I'll be adding it as a correction on the site and in the forums.

Ranged +X should say: This creature gains + X attack dice when it makes a ranged attack. Has no effect on zone attacks. Does not grant a ranged attack if this creature does not have one. If the attack makes multiple attacks against the same or different objects, it gains this bonus only for the first attack it makes.
 
This is how all similar traits work, including Bloodthirsty +X, Mana Drain +X, Mana Transfer +X, Melee +X, etc.
 
It still has no effect on zone attacks.

Thanks, and sorry for the confusion!


I'm a little confused on "first attack" and card interactions. Obviously, if something has Doublestrike or Triplestrike the first attack is clearly defined. And with Chain Lightning the first attack is clear because all 3 of those examples are the same action. But what about Battle Fury? Technically it is a second attack, but I also consider it a separate action. Let's say a fully tricked out Warlock casts Battle Fury on himself. Does he roll 9 dice twice or 9 then 4?

Arcanus

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2012, 11:37:30 AM »
Good question.  He rolls 9 dice twice!  Battle Fury costs a lot because we expected players to use it for a nasty combo like that.

We are going to clearly define that multiple attacks refers to multiple attacks within the same attack action.  Doublestrike, Triplestrike, and Sweeping all are multiple attacks within the same attack action.

We have a ranged attack coming out with triplestrike (Dwarf gatling crossbow), so the Ranged +X trait will only apply to his first attack.

Shad0w

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2012, 11:40:07 AM »
Quote from: "Arcanus" post=2438
Good question.  He rolls 9 dice twice!  Battle Fury costs a lot because we expected players to use it for a nasty combo like that.

We are going to clearly define that multiple attacks refers to multiple attacks within the same attack action.  Doublestrike, Triplestrike, and Sweeping all are multiple attacks within the same attack action.

We have a ranged attack coming out with triplestrike (Dwarf gatling crossbow), so the Ranged +X trait will only apply to his first attack.


That Dwarf is some good. :ohmy:
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Koz

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2012, 11:58:05 AM »
Man, Arcanus just got me pumped up for an expansion!  Can't wait to see what new stuff is coming out!  Hopefully both the expansion and the 2nd Core Spell Tome wilI be out by the end of the year.  I'm hoping for a good Christmas as far as Mage Wars is concerned :)

Mestrahd

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Re: Ranged +1 and Chain Lightning
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2012, 06:25:40 PM »
Thanks Arcanus! That justifies Battle Fury's spot in my build! I was thinking it only applied to same action multiple attacks, but wasn't sure.