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Author Topic: "after the action phase"  (Read 2835 times)

exid

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"after the action phase"
« on: October 16, 2016, 03:05:13 AM »
I'm affraid I allready asked this one three or four times...

If something happens "after an action phase", does it happen befor or after the quick cast phase that comes after this action phase?

Borg

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2016, 05:06:28 AM »
I think the order you choose is up to you. Your QC is essentially also just something that happens before or after an activation.

I'll give an example which imo is perfectly legal ( correct me if wrong )

You have just summoned Ehren and now you use your QC to play a minor heal.
Let's say you fall just one short of completely healing him so you decide to use your hand of Bim Shalla to heal the remaining 1 damage.

HoBS also happens before or after an activation but you can play other effects before or after as well , in the order you wish.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2016, 05:08:42 AM by Borg »
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Zuberi

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2016, 09:52:49 AM »
Borg is correct. Quick cast is just one thing among many that can occur before or after an action phase. When multiple things happen during the same time period, you choose the order. If there is a timing conflict, such as your opponent wants to reveal an enchantment, then initiative decides the order to resolve the conflict.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2016, 09:54:50 AM by Zuberi »

Kaarin

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2016, 10:22:22 AM »
QC is a bit different from other such effects as it has word 'immediately' in its definition. So You can't QC Hand of Bim Shalla and use it before activation, but You can QC the Hand after activation and then use it.
Other than QC You can use multiple 'before or after' effects in a row in the order You choose.

Quote from: Arena Rulebook p. 8
You can use your quickcast action
at three times during the Action Stage:
During the First Quickcast Phase
Immediately before or after any creature
you control takes its Action Phase
During the Final Quickcast Phase
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Borg

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2016, 10:44:54 AM »
So You can't QC Hand of Bim Shalla and use it before activation

I think that is not correct.
I think it is perfectly possible to QC HoBS, then use it to give your mage +1 armor, then activate another friendly creature for example.
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exid

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2016, 10:57:26 AM »
I'm affraid I got contradictory answers...

"Imediatly" is the problem.

Can I use the Hand after an action and then QC?

RomeoXero

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2016, 11:21:41 AM »
You cannot cast Hobs during first or last QC phase and then use it. What you CAN do is hold your QC,then before you activate your mage for his full action you can QC a Hobs, use it to give your mage +1 mellee, then immediately activate your mage for a full action, whatever it may be
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jacksmack

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2016, 11:24:47 AM »
QC is a bit different from other such effects as it has word 'immediately' in its definition. So You can't QC Hand of Bim Shalla and use it before activation, but You can QC the Hand after activation and then use it.
Other than QC You can use multiple 'before or after' effects in a row in the order You choose.

Quote from: Arena Rulebook p. 8
You can use your quickcast action
at three times during the Action Stage:
During the First Quickcast Phase
Immediately before or after any creature
you control takes its Action Phase
During the Final Quickcast Phase

It has been ruled that what your saying is not the case.

Otherwise you could ruin your opponents chance of using QC by revealling enchantments.

exid

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2016, 12:01:54 PM »
Otherwise you could ruin your opponents chance of using QC by revealling enchantments.

  ;D that's a point!

RomeoXero

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2016, 12:11:58 PM »
I think there's some confusion here. What questions are being answered here? In the case of Hand of Bim Shala you can absolutely use your quick cast before a friendly activation to cast HoBs. Then you may use the temples effect to add a melee +1 to a timber wolf, then you may activate that timber wolf and hit someone with 5 dice. How is this not clear? Am i wrong? Am i answering the wrong questions? What's the deal
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Kelanen

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2016, 12:38:39 PM »
QC is a bit different from other such effects as it has word 'immediately' in its definition.

'Immediately' means nothing - it's been ruled that it was just random verbiage with no rules meaning.

Kaarin

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2016, 07:22:03 PM »
QC is a bit different from other such effects as it has word 'immediately' in its definition.

'Immediately' means nothing - it's been ruled that it was just random verbiage with no rules meaning.
Then it should be removed from the rules and not repeated in every edition.
I must have missed the topic it was ruled in. Can You give me link to it?
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Zuberi

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2016, 09:16:53 PM »
You use the quick cast immediately after your action phase, but you also want to use hand of bim shalla immediately after your action phase. Thus they are both going off at the same time and you choose the order to resolve them in. Does that help it to make sense?

There are no prescribed steps or order of things between phases. Anything that happens between phases is happening in the same period in time, and merely requires an order of resolution to be decided. If all effects are controlled by the same person, they decide the order. Initiative decides any timing conflicts when both players want to do things.

exid

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2016, 11:47:15 PM »
Then it should be removed from the rules and not repeated in every edition.

+1!

Kelanen

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Re: "after the action phase"
« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2016, 08:54:49 AM »
Then it should be removed from the rules and not repeated in every edition.
I must have missed the topic it was ruled in. Can You give me link to it?

Not off hand, but I'll have a look.

Essentially, 'Immediately' could be read (as you are reading it, to be a kind of 'Interrupt' speed that's faster than 'Instant' speed (for those of you that were playing MtG 15-20 years ago. But it doesn't...

In fact it just means straight after, as other things can go straight after, and there aren't two different speeds or immediacies -  they all work the same, in player determined or initiative order, as usual.