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Author Topic: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired  (Read 11661 times)

paulylol

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A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« on: October 31, 2012, 03:12:19 AM »
Hello fellow Mage Wars players, first things first I'm happy that I've bought this awesome game, the only problem so far I've had is the dice, but you can always think about average rolls so it lessens the luck. But to the main topic - I'm your basic enthustiastic gamer, I get hyped about new games, I wanna test them out etc etc. but there's one problem still in the ''card gaming business'' even though the classical collectible card game format is dropped. I'm talking about not getting all the cards for reasonable price. I've had this same problem with Fantasy Flight Games Warhammer Invasion and Android Netrunner.

So what I'm asking is, please, be the first company to make it easy to get all the cards and for reasonable price. The problem is for hardcore gamer like me that you can include six level one spells and four of higher level spells. I would need to buy probably four (or more even?) boxes of Mage Wars.

I do realize that selling cards cheaper / in more affordable collection box seems quite risky. But there are probably many players who don't get into card games like this because ''oh I can get in with just 50$ BUT if I want to be competitive I have to spend 300$''.

So make a man's dream come true and make a box compatitible with the core box which would give max ammount of all cards - even better would be the ammount for two players  :)

Nihilistiskism

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2012, 06:03:26 AM »
Quote from: "Nekrah" post=2794
Hello fellow Mage Wars players, first things first I'm happy that I've bought this awesome game, the only problem so far I've had is the dice, but you can always think about average rolls so it lessens the luck. But to the main topic - I'm your basic enthustiastic gamer, I get hyped about new games, I wanna test them out etc etc. but there's one problem still in the ''card gaming business'' even though the classical collectible card game format is dropped. I'm talking about not getting all the cards for reasonable price. I've had this same problem with Fantasy Flight Games Warhammer Invasion and Android Netrunner.

So what I'm asking is, please, be the first company to make it easy to get all the cards and for reasonable price. The problem is for hardcore gamer like me that you can include six level one spells and four of higher level spells. I would need to buy probably four (or more even?) boxes of Mage Wars.

I do realize that selling cards cheaper / in more affordable collection box seems quite risky. But there are probably many players who don't get into card games like this because ''oh I can get in with just 50$ BUT if I want to be competitive I have to spend 300$''.

So make a man's dream come true and make a box compatitible with the core box which would give max ammount of all cards - even better would be the ammount for two players  :)


Hello, Nekra. Welcome to the forum.

Am I correct in reasoning that you are requesting packs of cards, sans board, dice, tokens, etc? That would probably be do-able from a financial standpoint, but it is an unlikely scenario from the perspective of hosting a sound business model.

The better alternative is that Arcane Wonders follows the reasonable and sound business model of redistribution through expansion, which is a concept enveloping the release of new cards for the base game in tandem with reprints of older, popular cards from the base game. This serves multiple purposes in that it increases the card pool (expands the broader game and enriches the game through added stock) and lowers the barrier for "suitcase" players and collectors, allowing them to (albeit on a schedule restricted by release) gradually fulfill complete "playsets" of every card in the game.

This formula is in use by a few companies, already, and is tried-and-true.

Under the current distribution, it is perfectly possible to be a "competitive" (whatever that means...there is no organized play system yet in place) Mage Wars player with only the base game and 1 or 2 copies of the current expansion.

Good Gaming.

-nihil
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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2012, 06:38:22 PM »
1st: if you want to use more copies (legal) then you have available, take some little paper and write down the spell on it. Replace the paper with the according spell when possible.

2nd: if a certain spell is limited, face it and make the best of it.
Isn't that the beauty of these games. Looking for the best strategy with any given combinations instead of altering combinations to get the best strategy?

Nekrah

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2012, 05:19:55 AM »
Quote
Am I correct in reasoning that you are requesting packs of cards, sans board, dice, tokens, etc? That would probably be do-able from a financial standpoint, but it is an unlikely scenario from the perspective of hosting a sound business model.


I only wish more cards, I do not have need for boards, dice etc.

Quote
The better alternative is that Arcane Wonders follows the reasonable and sound business model of redistribution through expansion, which is a concept enveloping the release of new cards for the base game in tandem with reprints of older, popular cards from the base game. This serves multiple purposes in that it increases the card pool (expands the broader game and enriches the game through added stock) and lowers the barrier for "suitcase" players and collectors, allowing them to (albeit on a schedule restricted by release) gradually fulfill complete "playsets" of every card in the game.


I do see the point of redistributing more cards in upcoming expansions but the problem is they are upcoming. And for me, being competitive means that I can have maximum amount of any card I deem powerful, take example of Magic the Gathering, you usually want to max the most important cards for your deck in order it to run well.

Quote
2nd: if a certain spell is limited, face it and make the best of it.
Isn't that the beauty of these games. Looking for the best strategy with any given combinations instead of altering combinations to get the best strategy?


Playing Sealed format is different kind of thing, in deckbuilding I wish to have all the options available. If I want to have four of those legendary creatures in my spellbook, then I should be able to do it.

Simplify

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2013, 05:01:33 PM »
I totally agree with Nekra, since MW insist this is not a CCG or a LCG it should be sold as a Board Game, meaning it should be complete. I should not have to buy extra Base Set or Core Set to be able to play it, if I'm allowed X copies of a card I should have it right from the start. Having to buy more cards makes it a CCG in  reality.

This game is awesome, I love it, but to play it the way it should be, I had to buy 2 Base Set and 2 Core Set 1, something I won't be doing  for the Forcemaster expansion. So I really wish they will sell the expansions with all the copies the rules permits.

pixelgeek

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2013, 07:03:05 PM »
Quote from: "Simplify" post=6394
I totally agree with Nekra, since MW insist this is not a CCG or a LCG it should be sold as a Board Game, meaning it should be complete.


It is

Quote from: "Simplify" post=6394
I should not have to buy extra Base Set or Core Set to be able to play it.


You don't

Quote from: "Simplify" post=6394
if I'm allowed X copies of a card I should have it right from the start. Having to buy more cards makes it a CCG in  reality.


Most people don't want to pay $100 for a board game.

Since if you want all the cards you can get them I really don't know what the fuss is about.
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Simplify

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2013, 07:26:03 PM »
If it was complete I wouldn't have to buy extra copies, I'd rather pay $100.00 and be done with it. Most people might not want to rebuy a game that they already bought either. People might also want to play a game to is fullest, maybe you're happy with a partial game but others might see it differently. Most people bought the Base and one Core Spell dishing pretty close to $100.00 anyway so I don't see the fuss either.

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2013, 08:19:06 PM »
Quote from: "Simplify" post=6397
If it was complete I wouldn't have to buy extra copies...


Again, you don't have to. If you want to then that is one thing but the game is very playable and quite a lot of fun, and complete, in the core set.

You need to distinguish between wanting something and being required to buy it. Simply wanting to have more card options doesn't mean that they are necessary to play the game.
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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2013, 10:31:34 PM »
Again, what is necessary or not is a subjective concept, to you it is not, you are satisfy to play with a fraction of the possibilty which is ok you save money, but other people think it's essential and a lot more fun when you can play with the whole array of possibilities. When you buy a game you expect to be able to execute all the stategies that are contain within that game. The point is: to play MW the way it is intended by the rules you have to buy many copies of the base set and the core set, with 2 copies of the base set and 2 of the core set 1 I still don't have the 6 copies of every level 1 spells and 4 copies of the higher level, that's $140.00 and still I don't have all the cards, so yes I would pay $100.00 for the base set with ALL the cards I'm allowed to play by the rules of this game. You see the fact that you don't need all the cards doesn't do any good to those who want them, for those people, which are just as important to MW than you, the game will be to expansive to follow and some will stop playing because of it. Do you catch my drift or do you still think that everybody should feel like you do and the heck with the rest?

pixelgeek

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2013, 11:39:56 PM »
Quote from: "Simplify" post=6405
Do you catch my drift or do you still think that everybody should feel like you do and the heck with the rest?


I understand you. I just think that you're complaining about nothing of any actual concern.
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mitkosim

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2013, 04:30:43 AM »
Actually he is not. I had raised this exact same question in a thread long, long ago. When you are doing a card game with multiples of cards allowed, there will be a certain subset of your customers (let's call them hardcore gamers for ease) who would want to have all the options. This is not a Mage Wars thing, it's a card game thing - Magic and all of FFG's LCGs are in the exact same boat. Magic is a CCG, however, and people know right out of the bat that they have to hunt for those cards. LCGs and MW, on the other hand, purport to not having to hunt cards. In my previous thread, I clearly stated that I am on-board with the Core Set being as it is - it's meant to present a playable and enjoyable experience from one box and it does. Hardcore gamers will just have to buy a couple + maybe some CSTs ... BUT ... this is where it needs to stop. Going forward, if this game intends to maintain an audience of said hardcore gamers, the products need to be assembled appropriately vis-a-vis card distribution. If they are not, this game cannot claim to be anything other than a casual one or it becomes a gigantic money sink, second only the evil Magic (okay, maybe some other CCGs that I am not aware of as well).

I have also bought 2 core sets in order to expand my options and I was even considering getting one of each CST but I decided against it - I am not starting down that path with this game. At the same time, I am among those hardcore gamers so I would expect to have a much more reasonable way to get cards from here on out. If not, this was not the game for me and I will have to relocate my board game budget elsewhere. Incidentally, I don't need 6x of every lvl 1 spell or 4 of every higher lvl, but the card distribution in the core set is rather off. You cannot have 1x of Hand of Bim Shalla (a lvl 1) or 1x Lash of Hellfire (pretty central to the equip Warlock and a priority Dissolve target) and build what I would consider a competitive deck including either. That's what it boils down to for me.

For reference, here is the older thread with everyone who agreed with this viewpoint "of no actual concern."
http://magewars.com/jsite/forum/player-feedback-and-suggestions/1101-card-distribution-in-future-products

Simplify

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2013, 06:36:52 AM »
It seems there is a few who share my concerns about MW, I hope MW will take notice and find a way to ease the financial burden for those who want to play the game to its full capacity.

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2013, 08:34:40 AM »
An idea I had some time ago, which I posted and never got much notice, was I think a compromise between the casual gamers and the hardcore gamers in terms of the distribution of cards in future expansions.

it goes like this:

include 3 copies of all level 1 spells
2 copies of all higher level spells
1 copy of all epic spells

this would, I think, satisfy the casual gamer. and for the hard core gamer, yes, you would have to spend more to get the "full" set of cards, but you will only have to buy one extra copy of any given expansion (as opposed to 2 or 3 plus 2 or 3 of the tomes)

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2013, 09:49:53 AM »
I think the term is completist as opposed to hard core gamer. Not all hard-core gamers are completist and not all completist are hard core gamers. Many are both, but I am parsing words. I am a completist myself so I understand that point of view. I would say, that mage wars challenges my completist nature because I find I don't need all those copies of the spells.

When this topic was previously discussed I suggested arcane wonders having a single store where people could buy single copies or multiple copies of the cards they wanted. I still think this is the best way to accommodate everybody.

Simplify

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Re: A Dream: All the Cards easily acquired
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2013, 10:04:52 AM »
This would be a great improvement, it still mean buying 2 copies of every expansion but I could live with that if the price is fair.